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Iron-cock

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Posts posted by Iron-cock

  1. I sort of blew off your reply because it was silly, you seem to get a bit emotional about your hometown team.

    Please explain how points allowed is better than total yards allowed when measuring a defense, when there are so many factors

    Yards against is a valuable fantasy stat, since yards against is how most fantasy scoring happens. Points against, or average points against is what I'd use as a simple measure of NFL defenses.

    Total Yards has many factors, the most common one being that a good defense will play prevent near the end of games in order to win. Thus teams can rack up yards against a good defense, but not necessary points.

    I think you know all of this.

    Just to give you an example, the 2000 Ravens were second in "Team Defense" aka total yards given up that year. They were first in points against. Now were the Ravens the second best defense in 2000, or first? At some point we can just use the eye test too, I watched the 2000 Ravens and yes they were the best defense in the league.

    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2000/opp.htm

    That can give you an idea of how misleading yards against can be.

    To bring it back to Brady vs Manning, Brady's early career success came mostly due to his coach and defense. Manning dragged one of the worst defensive units ever to a superbowl win.

    • Haha 1
  2. If championships and playoff success don't matter when comparing QBs of similar statistical success, then you could easily argue that Drew Brees is better than Tom Brady.

    I think that might be a fair argument when all is said and done.

    Now you're pretty much just trolling.

    If Brady was drafted by some other team, and Drew Brees was drafted by the Patriots....you think they would have won fewer Championships?

  3. How many games has Brady played where they just had to salt away the clock because it was a blowout?

    How many games has Brady played in, specifically in his statistical outlier season of 2007 where his team kept throwing the ball rather than running the clock out? What other QB gets to throw when blowing the other team out, because his coach wants to take a metaphorical dump on the NFL shield?

  4. If championships and playoff success don't matter when comparing QBs of similar statistical success, then you could easily argue that Drew Brees is better than Tom Brady.

    I think that might be a fair argument when all is said and done.

  5. Brady and Manning are very much alike when it comes to physical tools.

    That I can agree with. To say one has the clear advantage over the other is not fair, in my opinion.

    I think Peyton was a far better athlete physically coming out of college. Like the scouting report you posted mentioned (and the photos we've all seen), Brady didn't even look like a football player.

    As they evolved I think their physical tools, and more importantly mental tools became much more similar. Both (obviously) have NFL quality arms, neither are Favre or Flacco, but a QB doesn't need that to make it.

  6. As soon as Brady got a top WR in Moss, he broke records. That should tell you a lot about how Brady elevates the players around him.

    Moss was in the #1 offense back with the Vikings in 1998. I think it's fair to say Moss elevated Brady more than vice versa. Brady's TD's since his season with Moss have fallen back to -22% to 50% of their peak when he had Moss.

    Moss is underrated historically, due to the perception of him underachieving and his overall attitude.

  7. Here's how the Patriots have ranked in total defense since 2001, when Brady became the starter:
    2015: 9th
    2014: 13th
    2013: 26th
    2012: 25th
    2011: 31st
    2010: 25th
    2009: 11th
    2008: 10th
    2007: 4th
    2006: 6th
    2005: 26th
    2004: 9th
    2003: 7th
    2002: 23rd
    2001: 24th
    Average of 16.6

    Not sure where you're getting these numbers, I'm not going to effort all of them so here are the superbowl wins.

    2001: Allowed 272 points (17.0/g), 6th.

    2003: Allowed 238 points (14.9/g), 1st.

    2004: Allowed 260 points (16.2/g), 2nd.

    2014: Allowed 313 points (19.6/g), 8th.

    The focus of three of those Superbowl teams was their defense, Brady was not carrying that team back then.

    The fact is, Peyton had a lot more to do with the Colts 2006 Superbowl victory, winning it with the worst defense to ever win a Superbowl than Brady had to do with the Pats first three.

    2006: Allowed 360 points (22.5/g), 23rd.

    Brady didn't start carrying New England until 2007, and from then on they choked in the playoffs until they finally ran into someone dumb enough to give them a win (Pete Carroll).

  8. Is a safety's "hot take" he's trying to make controversial so he has a reason to be on the air really your argument here?

    You do know how these work right? If they're anything like other TV programs they'll solicit the "experts" opinion beforehand and if it fits the segment they'll have them on.

  9. Peyton Manning easily has the best stats of any QB ever there is no question about it, but how much should that matter in terms of who's better or the greatest. In 16 season Joe Montana only threw for 273TDs compared to Mannings 539TDs does that mean he is easily better than Montana?

    It's not just stats, if you watch the players from an impartial point of view, Peyton was much better than Brady was during Brady's early superbowl runs.

    I wouldn't compare stats from the 80's to QB's today. Football is a very different game now.

  10. In terms of who each had on offense throughout their careers:

    Marvin Harrison- 3rd all time career reception, 5th all time career receiving TD, 7th all time receiving yards (should be in the HOF)

    Reggie Wayne- 7th all time reception leader , 8th all time receiving yards

    Dallas Clark- Great TE for a short period of time but got killed by injuries

    Demaryius Thomas- Stud so far

    Eric Decker- Stud so far

    Wes Welker for 1 great year then got hurt

    Julius Thomas - Stud so far?

    Emmanuel Sanders- Good WR

    Brady's weapons -

    Moss (1 year, broke nearly ever record at the time)

    Gronk (6 years)

    Welker (6 years)

    Edelman- Former QB turned WR :wacko:

    You have to break out what those players did without the QB in question to evaluate them fairly.

    Peyton's weapons:

    Marvin Harrison- Did nothing until Peyton Manning got to town.
    Reggie Wayne- Had 960 yards and 4 TDs without Manning/Luck in 2011. Carried by his QBs.
    Dallas Clark- mediocre TE carried by Manning to a 1000 yard season in 2009.
    Demaryius Thomas- Solid #1 WR.
    Eric Decker- Good #2 WR.
    Wes Welker- Best slot WR of his generation.
    Julius Thomas - Carried to two 12 TD seasons with Manning, did nothing without him.
    Emmanuel Sanders- Wasn't a standout WR until getting to Denver with Manning.
    Brady's weapons -
    Moss- Best WR of the past 25 years, on two of the top 5 scoring offenses of all time.
    Gronk- Will go down as the best receiving TE of his generation, if not all time.
    Welker- Best slot WR of his generation.
    Edelman- Ok WR, has improved a lot in the past two seasons.
    Bill Belichick - Best coach of the past 15 years.
    Brady has had a much better supporting cast than Manning did with the Colts. Once Manning got to Denver he finally had some players and coaches around him to put him in position to win another superbowl.
  11. Look up Brady's stats from the Panthers Super Bowl win and tell me again it was led by defense? We've been over this. The first win over the Rams was absolutely not because of Brady. He was a game manager. But he was night and day better in 2003 and 2004 when they went back to back. 2014...you can blame it on Carroll, fine.

    Here are Tom Brady's gamelogs from 2003:

    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradTo00/gamelog/2003/

    He was not elite that year, he wasn't good in the playoffs. He had a good game in the superbowl.

    Take a look at the gamelogs, four games with multiple interceptions. Two playoff games where his completion percentage was below 60%, six games where his completion percentage was below 55%. That is Tebowesque! He had a 4 int game, and a 3 int game.

    Brady wasn't even close to being as good as Peyton Manning back then.

  12. Super Bowls matter when comparing great QBs, especially when you're talking about two of the top 5 or 6 QBs of all time.

    Most analysis of Peyton's final season has concluded that he was carried to a superbowl by a great defense. If we accept this as true, then we must consider that Brady's first 3 superbowls were mostly won by the defense and head coach.

    Not true at all. Only the 2001 SB did the defense carry that team, and even then Brady led the GW drive -- which is why he was named MVP. Peyton wasn't even close to being SB MVP for last season, and for good reason.

    The 2003 SB, Carolina lit up NE's defense, and Brady had to lead them to 30+ points to win. Not a great defensive effort there. The 2004 SB was a similar story (but not as extreme).

    Peyton has had far superior offensive weapons at his disposal + being in a dome for most of his career, yet Brady has twice as many rings.

    The biggest arguments for Peyton would be his regular season superiority (records, 5 vs 2 league MVPs), and his 3-2 H2H playoff record against Brady. But Brady has twice as many rings and three times as many SB MVPs. Plus Brady's career isn't finished yet.

    You are mistaking the "Superbowl" for "The Superbowl Season". If we were just judging by who did what in the Superbowl, Phil Simms is one of the best QBs ever.

  13. Super Bowls matter when comparing great QBs, especially when you're talking about two of the top 5 or 6 QBs of all time.

    Most analysis of Peyton's final season has concluded that he was carried to a superbowl by a great defense. If we accept this as true, then we must consider that Brady's first 3 superbowls were mostly won by the defense and head coach.

    In addition, we have to consider the fact that when the Patriots switched to relying on Brady they've choked on multiple occasions. They choked against the Giants twice in the superbowl, and in the playoffs against the Jets in 2010. The Patriots as a team lead by Brady's passing would have to be considered a failure, outside of the fact that Pete Carroll was such a moron he didn't run Marshawn Lynch at the goal line.

    Contrast that with Peyton Manning, who carried his teams every single year from his sophomore season until mid 2014. His Colts team that won the superbowl had the worst defense that's won a superbowl ever.

    Peyton is clearly the better QB, the scouts knew it when the players were coming out of college and it's still true with Peyton's career over. Brady was just blessed to land with Belichick.

    • Like 1
  14. This is for a school project I just want to study more before I write about the two. How true is it that Brady has had better weapons than Manning? There is also some of the other guys think it was actually Manning having better weapons.

    Start here, read forward:

    http://forums.rotoworld.com/index.php?showtopic=507132&p=6212238

    Also, when considering "Weapons" how much of an advantage is having Bill Belichick as your head coach? How much better is he than say...Jim Caldwell.

    I have to say, this is the most clever way anyone has ever gotten me to do their homework for them.

    • Like 3
    • Haha 2
  15. Manning was surely better than Brady during the first part of Brady's career (Pre 2007) despite Brady's Superbowl wins during that time.

    During Brady's breakout year and afterwords (2007 on) they were closer, but I'd still rather take Peyton up until the second half of 2014.

    • Like 1
  16. The deal was agreed upon Monday, but there was a hang-up Wednesday morning when the Dolphins were reviewing Maxwell's physical. He suffered a sprained SC joint in his shoulder Week 15 and missed the final two games. Maxwell allegedly told the physician that he still can't bench press or do a push-up, but the Dolphins laughably have still signed off on the deal. Eagles "GM" Howie Roseman has pulled off a heist, moving up five spots in the first round AND getting the Dolphins to take Maxwell's albatross six-year, $63 million contract.



    Maxwell can be cut after 2016, with only a 3.6M cap hit. Not really an albatross of a deal.


    And they get Alonzo. All for moving down a few spots in the draft. It's not that horrible of a move assuming Maxwell will be healthy and can play a bit better than he did in PHI.

  17. "Concussions down 35% in '15" - Psygolf

    Not sure if u saw this Psy, but the new data suggests just the opposite. Concussions UP 32% in 2015.

    A result of lowering the diagnosis threshold, or a worsening problem?

    http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14672860/nfl-says-diagnosed-concussions-way-season

    From the article:

    "Among the possible explanations Miller mentioned were a doubling in the number of players screened for possible concussions"

    If you increase the screenings by 100%, but concussions only increase by 32% you probably don't have a worsening problem.

  18. Topical:

    Co-worker was informed a couple of days ago that his cousin's 16 year old son committed suicide by shooting himself. He had a pretty serious concussion from a water-skiing accident a few years ago, he recovered to what seemed full health, but the entire family all commented that he never acted like the same boy...moody, aggressive, in & out of trouble all of a sudden, and kicked out of several schools.

    There are brain injuries other than CTE.

  19. Let's not forget that for most athletes, loss of brain function is not an appreciable detriment.

    Carry on...

    I lol'ed. But then again...

    Helmuth von Moltke (whom most would consider intelligent) was famous for the quote "no plan survives contact with the enemy."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_von_Moltke_the_Elder

    "The tactical result of an engagement forms the base for new strategic decisions because victory or defeat in a battle changes the situation to such a degree that no human acumen is able to see beyond the first battle. In this sense one should understand Napoleon's saying: "I have never had a plan of operations."

    Therefore no plan of operations extends with any certainty beyond the first contact with the main hostile force"

    An athlete whom many think of as not so bright made a similar observation.

    https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mike_Tyson#On_boxing

    "Everybody has a plan until they get hit. Then, like a rat, they stop in fear and freeze." - Mike Tyson

    Sometimes you'll find wisdom in the strangest of places. Lets not pretend all of the players are worthless outside of football.

  20. The NFL is always behind on this stuff. Disclose the full risk, take the stance that you want to lead the way instead of having to be dragged kicking and screaming.

    From the NFL's point of view, going back to when Tags was commissioner:

    Assuming they have some nerds locked in a room crunching numbers regarding how many billions this will cost them...

    1. What if we give the players healthcare for life, but the average lifespan increases to 120?

    2. What if we delay the findings for 20 years and universal healthcare is enacted? Are we still on the hook for the same amount of damages? Healthcare for life?

    3. What if we delay the findings for 30 years and a genetic component is revealed, then we can come out and say "The technology wasn't there before for us to understand this".

    4. What if the full risk really isn't known?

    etc,etc.

    I'm not saying it's right, ideally a government would step in and bitchslap entities that try this sort of thing...but I can understand why they're not coming out and admitting to football being as bad as boxing for long term health.

  21. 2 Q's

    1) How long has the average NFL player been playing contact football before they reach the NFL?

    2) How long is the average NFL career?

    1. Long.

    2. Short, according to conventional wisdom but there is a 'survivor bias'. IE: Good players last longer. I have a hunch that most players that drop out of the league do so due to a skill deficit or old age rather than injury.

    Another interesting question, which is admittedly pretty narrow in focus...what other activities do players engage in before and after football that could lead to similar injury? Can someone like Matt Mitrione get a settlement even though his post-NFL career might cause brain trauma?

    For those who don't know who he is:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Mitrione

    He had a really tough weekend. Was sad to watch.

    http://www.mmafighting.com/2016/1/22/10815038/matt-mitrione-to-undergo-surgery-on-broken-orbital-bone

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