Jump to content
NBC Sports Edge Forums

Cotton Jones

Established Members
  • Content Count

    1,316
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Posts posted by Cotton Jones

  1. 12 hours ago, Fantasy Gooroo said:

    I thought for sure he would be able to get loose against Tampa Bay but I guess their defense is all of a sudden conveniently formidable

     

    No it's not. It has had (brief) moments recently, all at home. They are still terrible on the road. Home/road splits for their defense over the last month or so are drastic

     

    12 hours ago, Fantasy Gooroo said:

    But as someone smarter than me once said, all of the greats go through peaks and valleys.

     

    This is like if your wife caught you cheating on her, and you told her "all marriages go through peaks and valleys."

     

  2. On 12/20/2018 at 7:19 PM, SuperJoint said:

    I'd just let Cooper's future performance over the next couple years speak for itself. If he maintains the promise he's shown since the trade some posters here will feel quite foolish. 

     

    It was supposed to take me a couple years to look foolish. It only took you 3 days.

    Still gonna comp him to Julio since they both went to Alabama or something?

     

    On 12/19/2018 at 12:00 AM, SharkSwimmer said:

    4th round is a complete joke.  Cooper is the focal point of the Cowboys passing game.  Dude is going second round in drafts in any competent league.

     

    Amari still 6th best WR or...? What's the personal ranking system saying now?

    It was a total blowup spot at home vs Bucs - they even had the Bucs playing back at them - against arguably the worst pass d in the NFL he puts up a dud.

    Average Amari has been as disappointing as they come since he went pro and has never lived up to his potential

    You can throw all the negative stuff from this guy's past out the window and he's still on a run-first team with a dominant touch-hogging bellcow, a quarterback who is a middling talent, and a team philosophy and personnel that is run first.

    That makes him a 3-4th round pick at best.

    Simple stuff.

    Well, it should be.

  3. 1 minute ago, shypri said:

    So he is a top5 receiver with dak and zeke this year, but next year he will need zeke to miss many games to be a top10 receiver next year? :D

    Have you heard the term "sample size"?

     

    Are you saying that Amari Cooper is a top 5 WR? Where's the 'laughing' emoji

    • Haha 1
  4. 6 minutes ago, shypri said:

    How many games have Dak or Zeke missed since Amari joined the Cowgirls?

    How many will they miss in 2019? Because that's what we have been talking about here. His 2019 value. Don't move the goalposts.

    Because Zeke will have to miss a lot of 2019 games for Amari to be a top 10 WR.

    And the Cowboys offense will have to become high-powered, somehow.

    If you don't think situation matters in fantasy value and ADP, can't help you.

  5. 6 minutes ago, shypri said:

    Standard leagues last 4 weeks he has 78 points. Next best player is JuJu with 57 points. Since joining Dallas he is one of if not the most valuable wide receiver. Surely a small sample size, but if he finishes strong he will be a top10 receiver in almost any draft next year.

    And most people, at least judging by this thread, don't agree with that.

    Simply put, because Zeke Elliott is a person that exists and Dak Prescott is not good.

  6. Just now, SharkSwimmer said:

    Well we could look at the number of fantasy points Cooper has scored since joining the Cowboys, but I thought that was a so obvious that it did not need to be stated.  

    You decided to wait to involve stats until 30 posts in?

    I doubt that.

    Bring the stats.

  7. 4 minutes ago, Zak0221 said:

     

    I wouldn't want him as my WR1 next year, so I agree with you on some of your points.  I think most counterpoints are about 'someone' will take him super early, but the savy owners would rather see him slide a bit. 

     

    First off, you've already stated that you think Average Amari is the bee's knees earlier in this thread. And your reasoning was even thinner than SharkSwimmer. 

     

    Secondly this started not because "someone" said they want to take Amari early. No one cares.

    "Someone" claimed that unless Amari goes in the 2nd round or earlier in your league, that it is not a competent league.

    Which is a ridiculous statement.

    I've already gone over this

     

     

  8. 3 minutes ago, Zak0221 said:

     

    Why did you wake up to a new day and still decide to run to these forums to hate on ol Amari Pooper? 

    I was directly addressed by SharkSwimmer and quoted. I had put a nice bow on this yesterday, on the previous page, but he kept going. So you should really be asking him this question.

    Also, "Average Amari" is the preferred nickname

     

    3 minutes ago, Zak0221 said:

    He is finishing 2018 strong and if the Cowboys somehow find themselves in the playoffs and Cooper balls out, maybe even bc of Coop they win a playoff game will result in his draft stock in 2019 skyrocketing. 

     

    His draft stock is not going to skyrocket because his situation/2019 outlook is not advantageous.

    Been over this fact over and over.

    Many WR1's are in better situations and are actually proven.

     

     

    My stance from the beginning was that Amari Cooper is a 3rd round pick, at best.

    This is reasonable, realistic, and some would even say optimistic.

    If you think being realistic about his 2019 value - i.e. not believing him to be the 6th best WR - is hating on him, that's on you.

  9. 32 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    "last year's stats = next year's stats."

     

    The sooner you break out of this mindset, the sooner you will start to have more success at fantasy football.  I wish you well on your journey.

    Clearly it is I who does not understand how to win at fantasy football, because I do not think Average Amari is the 6th best WR in the NFL.

     

    Make that poll. Please.

     

    Extravagant claims (Amari is overall WR6) require extravagant evidence, of which you have none.

    Or really any evidence would be helpful. Other than your "personal ranking system" which you still have not quantified in any way. So, basically, your feelings is why Amari is overall WR6. The sooner you break out of this mindset... you get the idea.

  10. 4 hours ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    Well, I did not want to do this, but here you go.

     

    Oh damn man, you didn't want to use a list to argue your point about Average Amari, but I pushed you to that brink! After about 20 posts of talk about "personal ranking systems," feelings and hunches, sprinkled with personal attacks

    Unfortunately, nothing on your very shaky list addresses the fact that NFL wide receivers don't suddenly "break out" in their fifth season and become top end WR1's. Which is what you have been arguing this entire time: that Amari Cooper only has 5 WR's that are better than him and is a 2nd round+ 2019 fantasy football pick.

     

    Take a poll here and see how many people agree with that. Not many. Because it's wrong.

     

    Also, nothing on your list refers to anything quantifiable, except his "plus NFL speed, quickness, short area burst, and route running" which I'm guessing he had when he entered the league. 

  11. 5 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    Okay, let's try this again.

     

    I believe Cooper will be a top-six wideout in 2019.  And I have stated many reasons for that projection in this thread.  I could restate them for you, but you could just read the thread instead, I suppose.  

     

    What is your response to the reasons I have given to support my projection?

    I have less than zero interest wasting my time re-litigating this entire thing. Just as you said, I suggest that you could just read the thread.

     

    And your "many reasons" for projecting Average Amari as a top-end WR1, second round pick or higher, are a joke. Based on nothing of substance. As I have stated. You could read the thread for more on my "response" on that.

  12. 7 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    Do you believe I should be able to pick the players I think will do well, even if I take them sooner than their amalgamated ADP?

     

    I sincerely do not care what you, or anyone else, does in drafts.

    We are talking about Average Amari's 2019 draft stock. Not fantasy draft philosophy. Or, contrary to what you seem to think, about me, or my character, or intellect.

    This is the reason we are talking about Average Amari's draft stock:

     

    On 12/19/2018 at 12:00 AM, SharkSwimmer said:

    4th round is a complete joke.  Cooper is the focal point of the Cowboys passing game.  Dude is going second round in drafts in any competent league.

     

    Not "I am going to take Amari in the 2nd round"

    Instead "your league is not competent if someone does not draft Amari Cooper by the second round."

    It's an absurd statement.

    We later found out that this is your point of you not based on any sort of reason or logic or statistics. It is because of your "personal ranking system" which is a world salad meaning nothing, other than what I would guess - with a fair amount of certainty - is your inability to separate your Cowboys fandom from the objective reality of the fantasy value of Cowboys players.

     

    I made an attempt to end this on the last page, but as long as you are going to directly address me with insulting language/personal attacks, I am going to continue to respond to defend myself. Using big words. If that makes you think that I'm "angry" then, uh, oh well.

  13. 6 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    You seem to have a lot of misplaced anger. 

     

    Because I pointed out how wrong you are about Average Amari.

    I literally just posted something hours ago about how you are projecting and using ad hominem attacks because you don't have a leg to stand on in this discussion.

  14. 7 minutes ago, devaster said:

    You are being quite a bit harsh. Amari isn't a top-10 WR, but he is borderline and in the discussion. Talent-wise he always has been. He runs great routes and gets open. And he had success in Oakland until Carr stopped throwing the ball his way. Dak isn't much of an upgrade, but consistent targets are something he wasn't getting in Oakland.

     

    He is a solid WR2.

    At the very beginning I said he was "third round PPR, at best."

    Read some of the ridiculous stuff that's been posted about his 2019 value. Only 5 WR's are better. Second round pick. Drafted after the first round turn.

    Now tell me how I'm being harsh.

  15. 1 hour ago, SuperJoint said:

    I'd just let Cooper's future performance over the next couple years speak for itself. If he maintains the promise he's shown since the trade some posters here will feel quite foolish. I've watched Coop since the AL days and he's the real deal. He was the first "Elite" WR at AL since Julio (whom I also had the pleasure of seeing back then):

     

    Alabama

    Player Catches Yards Avg. TDs
    Jones (2008-10) 179 2,653 14.8 15
    Cooper (2012-14) 228 3,463 15.2 31

    There are numbers from his professional career you could cite. They are probably more relevant than his college career.

     

    History is littered with great college WR's who never lived up to their promise in the NFL.

     

    If Amari was traded to a team with an Aaron Rodgers type QB with a high-powered offense, and was therefore guaranteed production and to be the focal point of the offense, this discussion would be dramatically different. He'd be a WR1.


    In reality, Zeke is far-and-away the focal point of the offense, they're built around running the football with a run-blocking O line and a QB who isn't a very good passer.

     

    If you've got something substantive about why his numbers in Oakland are irrelevant because now he's in Dallas, please review the last paragraph of my post linked below, where I ran over all those narratives, backed up, then ran over them again:

     

     

    So far, the only counterargument to the points I made about how the Cowboys situation isn't dramatically different from the one with the Raiders is that the Cowboys have better fans.

  16. 5 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    See, you keep trying to use this as an insult and I suppose you think you are quite clever.  

    You have been using actual insults and have also said I "obviously don't intellect" or something to that effect. So this is a clear case of projection. Ad hominem attacks are always a clear indication of the person making the attacks to have an incredibly weak position in a discussion.

    5 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    But I stand by my position that Cooper will not just be a WR1 next year, but he will be top six.  I just think he is that good and is in that ideal a situation.  To me, Cooper will be well worth a second round pick next year, and those who take the plunge will be happy they did.

    Cool. I'm glad you clearly outlined your preposterous take. As stated before, expect to be quoted next summer.


    Can we move on now and stop hijacking the thread? Or do you have more nonsense to spew that's unrelated to Amari's 2019 draft position, which is the topic at hand and the topic that I have repeatedly tried to steer the conversation back to?

     

  17. Just now, SharkSwimmer said:

    If you are going by ADP, you are a slave to last year's numbers. 

     

    How about being a slave to fandom and 2-3 good games out of a 16 game season?

     

    Just now, SharkSwimmer said:

    Let me guess--you avoided Saquon Barkley this year 

     

    Nope, but keep making stuff up to steer the subject away from only having 5 WR's ranked above Average Amari

  18. 5 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    See I think this might be your problem right here.  If you don't have a personal ranking system, how do you decide who to pick?  Auto-draft?

    No, but I would rather use auto-draft than use a "personal ranking system" that puts Average Amari in the 2nd round.

  19. 10 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    With Cooper's age, pedigree, speed, route running, size and strength, and his situation as an organizational priority on a playoff-caliber team,

    his what?

     

    11 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    my personal ranking system has Cooper very high indeed.  And I have defended my position in this thread. 

    Your personal ranking system, which is just some vague and undefined term used to rationalize your overranking of Average Amari, has been shown to be out of touch with reality. You have "defended your position" with irrational reasoning as to why Amari is better than all but 5 WR's in the league. For example, how the Cowboys fans cheer for him. What?

     

    11 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    If you have a different ranking system, that's fantastic for you. 

    I don't have a "personal ranking system" to determine where players will go in a draft. I rely on reality, that way I don't reach for players, like someone who drafts Average Amari in the 2nd round.

    Looks like you might need to revise or completely abandon your "personal ranking system"

     

     

    11 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    Help yourself to the Steady-Eddie Willie Sneads of the world.  You'll get little competition from me, as I will be hunting bigger game.

     

    Willie Snead? The more ridiculous your arguments get, the more you reveal your overranking of Amari to be equally ridiculous.

     

    11 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    You'll get little competition from me, as I will be hunting bigger game.

     

    I will also be "hunting bigger game." I will be "hunting" players who will score more fantasy points than Average Amari. That's kind of the point...

     

  20. 30 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    I don't expect you to understand why a player's mental well being is important to his performance, because it seems a little too sophisticated a concept for your limited intellect to grasp.  I suspect you have never played or coached a sport.

    Right, if anyone has shown a limited intellect over the last couple pages it's definitely me.

    Not the guy who thinks Amari is better than all but 5 WR's.

     

    Stick to the discussion and leave the insults aside. K thx

     

    30 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

      Because he won't be there in the third in competitive leagues.

     

    Wow, really sticking to that huh.

    See you next summer when Amari is going in the 3rd-4th, at best.

    Expect to be quoted.

  21. 6 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

    Dak seems to benefit from having a primary receiver who can get open.  And the opposing defenses are forced to focus on stopping Ezekiel Elliott.  Finally, the fans in Dallas really love Amari and they cheer like mad any time he catches a pass, which seems to be bolstering his possibly fragile ego to some extent.  Also, all the other Dallas receivers are pretty average.

     

    So I actually think Dallas is a pretty sweet set-up.

    So Average Amari is now a WR1 because of the fans in Dallas.

     

    If they're anything like you, I might have to agree, because he can keep on being average and the fans will blindly call him one of the top wide receivers in football.

     

    He's going to be better than he was in OAK because the fans in Dallas love to cheer for him. That's legit hilarious/awful

×
×
  • Create New...