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Ezekiel Elliott 2017 Season Outlook


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Yeah I agree.  Didn't he already say he's fighting this the whole way?  Thought I read it somewhere but can't recall where. 

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9 minutes ago, Rainyy said:

 

And what useful information is this supposed to be providing?

DId you read the article or would you like the cliff notes version? It basically says he can appeal, take it to court but still have to serve the suspension during that process UNLESS a judge grants him an injunction. Elliott would need to convince a judge that he would suffer irreparable harm if he misses any game.

 

Its an uphill battle for ZEKE but he could win if there is any new evidence or a misstep with the commissioners procedural steps.

Edited by ozark
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26 minutes ago, ozark said:

DId you read the article or would you like the cliff notes version? It basically says he can appeal, take it to court but still have to serve the suspension during that process UNLESS a judge grants him an injunction. Elliott would need to convince a judge that he would suffer irreparable harm if he misses any game.

 

Its an uphill battle for ZEKE but he could win if there is any new evidence or a misstep with the commissioners procedural steps.

 

I read the article, which is poor and also fails to mention a timeline. 

 

1) The league's appeals process will be resolved before the season even begins and the odds of it being overturned or even reduced after the NFL already did its investigation is basically zero. They have come under fire in the past for being too lenient on domestic abuse. This is a symbolic issue. Absolute best case for Zeke is that the NFL gets a neutral arbiter (i.e. not what happened for Brady), but, even then, the evidentiary burdens do not favor him. 

 

2) I am very familiar with injunctions. This is a temporary injunction, which is extremely hard to show. It's not just irreparable harm that Zeke must show; he must demonstrate probability of success on the merits (there are other elements, like feasibility of enforcement, that are less at issue)- that is, if the case were to proceed, it is more likely than not that he would win. Given the incredible deference given to arbitration agreements, this element will be extremely difficult to meet. 

 

Yes, you can point to the lower court's decision with Brady, but it was overturned. You think judges (even those in other districts) aren't aware of this? No one wants to be reversed. 

 

He is serving a 6 game suspension. 

 

Edited by Rainyy
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1 hour ago, dre said:

What I'm considering with Zeke is if he isn't kept this year, trying to draft him at the end of the 2nd beginning of 3rd just have him as a keeper for future fantasy seasons.  

 

In keeper leagues, I think he's definitely worth a 2nd rounder.  Especially when you consider a lot of good guys are already being kept, so the talent available in the 2nd round is even less.

 

For example: Howard, Ajayi, Murray, Gordon, and Thomas are being kept in my one standard league.  You can only keep for one year.  Mid 2nd round, the options are Miller, Gurley, Crowell...  Not a very hard decision for me there.  I'll guarantee myself Zeke in the 2nd next year, then run on some RBs.

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9 minutes ago, Rainyy said:

 

I read the article, which is poor and also fails to mention a timeline. Your conclusion that this process is likely to drag on is not well supported by the article. 

 

1) The league's appeals process will be resolved before the season even begins and the odds of it being overturned or even reduced after the NFL already did its investigation is basically zero. They have come on fire in the past for being too lenient on domestic abuse. This is a symbolic issue. 

 

2) I am very familiar with injunctions. This is a temporary injunction, which is extremely hard to show. It's not just irreparable harm that Zeke must show; he must demonstrate probability of success on the merits - that is, if the case were to proceed, it is more likely than not that he would win. Given the incredible deference given to arbitration agreements, this element is virtually guaranteed to NOT be met. 

 

Yes, you can point to the lower court's decision with Brady, but it was overturned. You think judges (even those in other districts) aren't aware of this? No one wants to be reversed. 

 

I am not sure what you are arguing as I said when I posted the article that it will prove difficult to reverse the suspension but that there certainly are ways it could happen.

 

It is likely to drag out.

 

You are merely basing the facts on what you think you know. Goodell's findings will become public information once this goes to federal court. I'm not saying there is but there certainly should be some contradictions and exaggerations from the defendant that Elliots team will likely prove.

 

As for his initial appeal if that is overruled and suspension holds he can sue before taking it to federal court. UNLIKELY but "He would assert that Goodell and his four experts committed grave procedural mistakes in evaluating the allegations and that, accordingly, they reached an arbitrary and capricious conclusion."

 

 

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2 minutes ago, ozark said:

I am not sure what you are arguing as I said when I posted the article that it will prove difficult to reverse the suspension but that there certainly are ways it could happen.

 

There are also ways I can win the lottery, but it's virtually pointless to talk about. 

 

2 minutes ago, ozark said:

It is likely to drag out.

 

The entire purpose of a temporary restraining order is that they are heard QUICKLY. That is how the "irreparable harm" asserted is prevented. You seem to confusing a pre-hearing with an entire trial. 

 

Once Elliott has exhausted the NFL's appeals process, which will happen before the season begins, he will have a ripe claim. If he chooses to proceed, he will file a TRO and/or preliminary injunction before the season begins. In all likelihood, this will be heard and decided before the suspension even begins (because that is the point). 

 

Only in the event that a preliminary injunction is granted, will this legal process "drag out" in such a way that a suspension is avoided. If it is not granted - which is extraordinarily likely - then Elliott will have to serve his suspension while challenging the procedural process as arbitrary and capricious during that time. If he were somehow to win, he could recover damages (e.g. lost salary), but he would have been suspended. 

 

Quote

As for his initial appeal if that is overruled and suspension holds he can sue before taking it to federal court. UNLIKELY but "He would assert that Goodell and his four experts committed grave procedural mistakes in evaluating the allegations and that, accordingly, they reached an arbitrary and capricious conclusion."

 

He could actually sue before state OR federal court. The court would have diversity, not federal question subject matter jurisdiction. Plaintiffs just prefer federal because they are generally less defendant-friendly. 

 

As you seem aware, "arbitrary and capricious" is a very difficult standard to prove. It would require truly egregious conduct on the part of the NFL. Keep in mind that the NFL's conduct in regards to Brady, was NOT found arbitrary and capricious. But, again, this is all moot if a preliminary injunction is not granted. Elliott would be serving his suspension while pursuing a claim in court. 

 

There's a possibility the case is even dismissed, although my guess is it survives a 12(b)(6) motion. 

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5 minutes ago, Rainyy said:

 

There are also ways I can win the lottery, but it's virtually pointless to talk about. 

 

 

The entire purpose of a temporary restraining order is that they are heard QUICKLY. That is how the "irreparable harm" asserted is prevented. You seem to confusing a pre-hearing with an entire trial. 

 

Once Elliott has exhausted the NFL's appeals process, which will happen before the season begins, he will have a ripe claim. If he chooses to proceed, he will file a TRO and/or preliminary injunction before the season begins. In all likelihood, this will be heard and decided before the suspension even begins (because that is the point). 

 

Only in the event that a preliminary injunction is granted, will this legal process "drag out" in such a way that a suspension is avoided. If it is not granted - which is extraordinarily likely - then Elliott will have to serve his suspension while challenging the procedural process as arbitrary and capricious during that time. If he were somehow to win, he could recover damages (e.g. lost salary), but he would have been suspended. 

 

 

He could actually sue before state OR federal court. The court would have diversity, not federal question subject matter jurisdiction. Plaintiffs just prefer federal because they are generally less defendant-friendly. 

 

As you seem aware, "arbitrary and capricious" is a very difficult standard to prove. It would require truly egregious conduct on the part of the NFL. Keep in mind that the NFL's conduct in regards to Brady, was NOT found arbitrary and capricious. But, again, this is all moot if a preliminary injunction is not granted. Elliott would be serving his suspension while pursuing a claim in court. 

 

There's a possibility the case is even dismissed, although my guess is it survives a 12(b)(6) motion. 

OMG make it stop. Feel like I'm a 1L again. Yuck.

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1 hour ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

In keeper leagues, I think he's definitely worth a 2nd rounder.  Especially when you consider a lot of good guys are already being kept, so the talent available in the 2nd round is even less.

 

For example: Howard, Ajayi, Murray, Gordon, and Thomas are being kept in my one standard league.  You can only keep for one year.  Mid 2nd round, the options are Miller, Gurley, Crowell...  Not a very hard decision for me there.  I'll guarantee myself Zeke in the 2nd next year, then run on some RBs.

 

Completely agree with you.  

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Not likely to be discussed much are the physical and mental setback this could be for a young player who was an instant superstar last year.

Will he get his head right, train hard, come out and run angry with fresh legs? 

Or

Will he get lost in this legal battle, lose focus, come out, start slow and distracted, maybe even tweak something, and spiral into a completely lost season?

 

I might consider taking the risk in a ten teamer because those drafts are fish in a barrel anyway...but that's about it for me and Zeke in 2017.

 

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1 hour ago, Rainyy said:

Once Elliott has exhausted the NFL's appeals process, which will happen before the season begins,

 

Why is this necessarily true?  Does the CBA require resolution of the appeal before weeek 1 of the season?  The NFL is notorious for taking its sweet time when challenged.  Goodell and company will want to make certain that they have investigated and thoroughly analyzed every substantive facet of Zeke's criticism of the original determination.  Because Zeke can play while the NFL does its thing, I don't understand why anyone is assuming that the appeal won't drag on into the season to some degree.

Edited by Rolling Thunder
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i think there is ALOT of speculation at this point.  IF, and I don't think he will, a judge gives him an injunction this could drag out.  I am operating as a 6 game suspension and will factor in his ADP accordingly.  If there is not resolution by the time I draft, I will probably let somebody else deal with it.  Too many unknowns for me right now, to invest the draft capital required to get him.

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3 hours ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

In keeper leagues, I think he's definitely worth a 2nd rounder.  Especially when you consider a lot of good guys are already being kept, so the talent available in the 2nd round is even less.

 

For example: Howard, Ajayi, Murray, Gordon, and Thomas are being kept in my one standard league.  You can only keep for one year.  Mid 2nd round, the options are Miller, Gurley, Crowell...  Not a very hard decision for me there.  I'll guarantee myself Zeke in the 2nd next year, then run on some RBs.

I think in Keeper/Dynasty Leagues he is still worth a 1st Round pick. I'd even go as far to say a top 6 pick.

Yes this looks like it will drag. But how many RB's out there will be better than Zeke? I'm not willing to let my competition snag him and use him against me in the future.

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ESPN's Adam Schefter forecasts Ezekiel Elliott's appeal hearing to take place Aug. 29.

It's good to have clarity on the date, but this being the NFL, we'll likely get an appeal to the appeal. With the situation so uncertain, fantasy owners should abide by the facts on the ground. The facts on the ground are that Elliott is suspended for the first six games of the 2017 season.
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36 minutes ago, lavaman said:

#3 in dynasty/keeper leagues

 

I was referring to single season leagues. 6 Games is pretty much half of the fantasy regular season. Where are you ranking him on your single season rankings?

 

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2 hours ago, Rolling Thunder said:

 

Why is this necessarily true?  Does the CBA require resolution of the appeal before weeek 1 of the season?  

 

The NFL has every incentive to schedule the appeal early - they do not want to appear weak and have Ezekial Elliott playing football while the appeal is pending. 

 

So the information that broke after your post does not surprise me:

 

29 minutes ago, mmcalli884 said:

 

ESPN's Adam Schefter forecasts Ezekiel Elliott's appeal hearing to take place Aug. 29.

 

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21 minutes ago, Rainyy said:

 

The NFL has every incentive to schedule the appeal early - they do not want to appear weak and have Ezekial Elliott playing football while the appeal is pending. 

 

So the information that broke after your post does not surprise me:

 

 

 

The appeal will be heard before week 1, but when it gets decided is another matter altogether, isn't it?

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4 minutes ago, Rolling Thunder said:

 

The appeal will be heard before week 1, but when it gets decided is another matter altogether, isn't it?

 

I think they hear it first, then they need to schedule a meeting to decide when the decision is gonna be made. :rolleyes:

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3 minutes ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

I think they hear it first, then they need to schedule a meeting to decide when the decision is gonna be made. :rolleyes:

 

Can Zeke appeal the date of the meeting to decide when they will meet to decide when the decision will be made?

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