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12 hours ago, 89Topps said:

 

I guess that works until you get a really bad trade.

 

Vetos exist for a reason.

Yeah, I think there needs to be some sort of safety net in place, especially since I imagine most of us are playing in money leagues. You'd think people can act with integrity and like adults, but as my case shows that's not always true; even with the best intentions. Humans are biased creatures. Brad Johnson at Fangraphs had a chat yesterday, and someone asked him a question. In this person's league, a guy was retroactively editing his roster to put in players who had hit HRs, achieved QSs, etc. It's pretty laughable that the software apparently allows this to occur (ESPN), but also eye-opening of just how brazen and pathetic people can be.

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This is one of the most challenging aspects of running fantasy leagues, but its one where I actually think having a keeper league of some sort makes things work, I think re-draft leagues at this point when some team in the dumper who has no shot is making deals, say with their friends?  Thats a recipe for disaster.  

 

Here is what we have:

1. No Veto unless...

2. Any owner in their first 2 seasons can have a trade called for a vote takes like 2/3

3. Commissioners clause - usually of suspected "I dont give a crap trade" and giving my buddy the goods.  Its hard to prove collusion, but these are the ones I think most leagues fear.  

 

As commissioner I try to be very open with owners about trading, especially new owners and I tell them (and all owners) if you are playing this game right, you are trying to win, whether its this year or trying to accumulate resources for the future, so if you are making a trade where you are selling off that high priced non keeper star OR an expiring contract star, let everyone in the league know on the board he is on the market, this way YOU get the best deal.  If you do that, there will never be an issue.  If you say nothing and give below market value trade to your work buddy and say YES to the only offer you have seen?  We will have issues and the trade wont happen and the two of you wont be back.  

 

 

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38 minutes ago, dmac88 said:

Yeah, I think there needs to be some sort of safety net in place, especially since I imagine most of us are playing in money leagues. You'd think people can act with integrity and like adults, but as my case shows that's not always true; even with the best intentions. Humans are biased creatures. Brad Johnson at Fangraphs had a chat yesterday, and someone asked him a question. In this person's league, a guy was retroactively editing his roster to put in players who had hit HRs, achieved QSs, etc. It's pretty laughable that the software apparently allows this to occur (ESPN), but also eye-opening of just how brazen and pathetic people can be.

I see nothing wrong with that feature ...that feature is awesome the commissioner (league manager) can select his owners he wants in his league, instead of random people just joining. A rather play in a league manager league than any public league. 

 

but you are right people are so pathetic and will cheat .... I have read so many threads (old espn boards to reddit) about people cheating using that feature to win. A little story about ten years ago my youngest son started playing fantasy football (he was just around 12 years old) he was a league manager who invited owners into his league ... I caught him cheating (more like he told me he moved a player who was on his bench to his starting lineup) I told him that was not allowed and he said that feature allows him to move players so it is alright. I mention something about ethics and would he like his opponent to do what he did. He agreed but a couple of weeks later I seen he made another move .... to win that week. lol. I laughed it off - let him have his day ..  I chalked it up as him being immature.... 

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4 hours ago, shakestreet said:

I see nothing wrong with that feature ...that feature is awesome the commissioner (league manager) can select his owners he wants in his league, instead of random people just joining. A rather play in a league manager league than any public league. 

 

but you are right people are so pathetic and will cheat .... I have read so many threads (old espn boards to reddit) about people cheating using that feature to win. A little story about ten years ago my youngest son started playing fantasy football (he was just around 12 years old) he was a league manager who invited owners into his league ... I caught him cheating (more like he told me he moved a player who was on his bench to his starting lineup) I told him that was not allowed and he said that feature allows him to move players so it is alright. I mention something about ethics and would he like his opponent to do what he did. He agreed but a couple of weeks later I seen he made another move .... to win that week. lol. I laughed it off - let him have his day ..  I chalked it up as him being immature.... 

If those are your ethics I'd rather not play in any league you are a commish in. Changing players after the game would be one of the most blatant forms of cheating there is. And a nice lesson in learning by letting your son get away with doing it. I am sure the other owners were glad you let him have his day

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12 minutes ago, Low and Away said:

If those are your ethics I'd rather not play in any league you are a commish in. Changing players after the game would be one of the most blatant forms of cheating there is. And a nice lesson in learning by letting your son get away with doing it. I am sure the other owners were glad you let him have his day

you need some crybaby hankies ..

 

it was over 10 years ago ... Kevin made the league begged me to join I did and so did a bunch of random people .. I caught it a week or two late by that  time the league was over.

 

 

 

Edited by shakestreet
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20 minutes ago, Low and Away said:

If those are your ethics I'd rather not play in any league you are a commish in. Changing players after the game would be one of the most blatant forms of cheating there is. And a nice lesson in learning by letting your son get away with doing it. I am sure the other owners were glad you let him have his day

 

Oh Christ.

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5 minutes ago, Low and Away said:

Gee sorry but I put a lot of time into playing. Cheating has no place in a competition. 

 

Good thing you weren't playing in some 10 year old's fantasy football league 10 years ago then.

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7 minutes ago, Low and Away said:

How many redrafts have you checked ages of people in the league?

 

I'm sure Gary appreciates your parenting advice though, and is real broken up you won't be playing in any of his leagues.

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7 hours ago, shakestreet said:

I see nothing wrong with that feature ...that feature is awesome the commissioner (league manager) can select his owners he wants in his league, instead of random people just joining. A rather play in a league manager league than any public league. 

 

but you are right people are so pathetic and will cheat .... I have read so many threads (old espn boards to reddit) about people cheating using that feature to win. A little story about ten years ago my youngest son started playing fantasy football (he was just around 12 years old) he was a league manager who invited owners into his league ... I caught him cheating (more like he told me he moved a player who was on his bench to his starting lineup) I told him that was not allowed and he said that feature allows him to move players so it is alright. I mention something about ethics and would he like his opponent to do what he did. He agreed but a couple of weeks later I seen he made another move .... to win that week. lol. I laughed it off - let him have his day ..  I chalked it up as him being immature.... 

I've never used ESPN, so what is the point of this feature? I understand a commish would like to be able to retroactively make changes in case there are any league issues. But to give that power to each team is just asking for trouble. Unless I'm misunderstanding the feature.

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1 hour ago, dmac88 said:

I've never used ESPN, so what is the point of this feature? I understand a commish would like to be able to retroactively make changes in case there are any league issues. But to give that power to each team is just asking for trouble. Unless I'm misunderstanding the feature.

 

Only the LM has the ability to retroactively adjust rosters.

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12 minutes ago, 89Topps said:

 

Only the LM has the ability to retroactively adjust rosters.

 

I believe you only have the ability to retroactively adjust rosters the day of a lock.  If it's a daily league, you can retroactively change the lineup until midnight for that day only. If it's weekly (assuming a lineup locks on monday like most weeks), you can retroactively adjust the lineup until midnight monday.  You cant retroactively change things the day after the lock period. 

 

If it is done, you'd be able to see it as an LM action under the team logs.

 

As an LM in many espn leagues,  I'll once in a while get a text from someone in the league saying "the period locked earlier than I thought and I have an empty spot at ____, can you put so and so in". I generally make the change for them if its reasonable.  

Edited by brockpapersizer
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34 minutes ago, brockpapersizer said:

 

I believe you only have the ability to retroactively adjust rosters the day of a lock.  If it's a daily league, you can retroactively change the lineup until midnight for that day only. If it's weekly (assuming a lineup locks on monday like most weeks), you can retroactively adjust the lineup until midnight monday.  You cant retroactively change things the day after the lock period. 

 

If it is done, you'd be able to see it as an LM action under the team logs.

 

As an LM in many espn leagues,  I'll once in a while get a text from someone in the league saying "the period locked earlier than I thought and I have an empty spot at ____, can you put so and so in". I generally make the change for them if its reasonable.  

 

The only time I could see adjusting a roster as a LM is if someone violated a rule regarding their roster.  Like if you had a rule stating everyone must field a full roster, but someone dropped their only catcher for a SP stream.  Or, if you have a hard cap on starts and someone exploits that loophole going over the start max on Sunday.  Then, I could see the LM going in and retroactively dropping, or benching the pitcher, since they were rostered illegally. 

 

I've had guys accidentally drop a player before, and I went in and added that player back to their roster.  I don't think I'd adjust a roster just because someone forgot to start a guy and missed the lock time though.

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6 minutes ago, 89Topps said:

 

 

I've had guys accidentally drop a player before, and I went in and added that player back to their roster.  I don't think I'd adjust a roster just because someone forgot to start a guy and missed the lock time though.

 

I play in weekly leagues. So sometimes FAAB processes at like 8 AM (PST) and locks at 10 AM some weeks.  If someone has an empty spot and have a player on their bench who hasn't even played that day, I don't see the harm. I totally get being a strict "no because someone forgot.... I totally see that point of view.  But having an empty roster spot in a weekly league just sucks if it was an accident. 

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2 minutes ago, brockpapersizer said:

 

I play in weekly leagues. So sometimes FAAB processes at like 8 AM (PST) and locks at 10 AM some weeks.  If someone has an empty spot and have a player on their bench who hasn't even played that day, I don't see the harm. I totally get being a strict "no because someone forgot.... I totally see that point of view.  But having an empty roster spot in a weekly league just sucks if it was an accident. 

I agree. I'm in a weekly league & have been commish for many years. These types of things happen rarely, but "spirit of the rule" is important.

Side note: Our weekly waivers go through Saturday evening at 11 pm, but guys aren't added to roster until Monday. So owners have all day Sunday to set lineup for following week. 

Side Side note: re: the vetoes- We've never had a trade vetoed in over 20 years as a league. A combination of a lot of things probably, including good owners, but being publicly fried by friends might be the best deterrent. 

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54 minutes ago, brockpapersizer said:

 

I play in weekly leagues. So sometimes FAAB processes at like 8 AM (PST) and locks at 10 AM some weeks.  If someone has an empty spot and have a player on their bench who hasn't even played that day, I don't see the harm. I totally get being a strict "no because someone forgot.... I totally see that point of view.  But having an empty roster spot in a weekly league just sucks if it was an accident. 

 

That makes sense.

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Question for the folks on here:

In one of my fantrax leagues where I am the commissioner I have Chris Taylor and have exclusively been using him as my 2B or MI.  The other day I noticed that per our league rules he should also be listed as 3B eligible as that was his primary position played last season.  For some reason he was only listed as 2b/MI/ OF/UT even though other Fantrax leagues, ESPN, CBS, etc all list him at 3B as Primary Position.

Directly from our league rules on Fantrax;s site :20 games last season at a position or 10 games this season.   Note: If a player does not qualify for any positions based on the above selections, he will qualify at the position(s) played most in the previous MLB season. If he did not play at all last season, then the default position(s) will be used. Last season Taylor played the most at 3B.  No ambiguity here.   Obviously it is a computer glitch on our league site.  I used commissioner override to update his position status to include 3B like I have done in past for players on other teams in the instances where Fantrax had errors

 

I now have a few teams in my league chirping that I was somehow cheating because I corrected the error and as commissioner "I should have asked permission first before I corrected the position eligibility"   Note these are the same people that like to chirp on every other trade that doesn't involve them " that trade does not smell right"

I mean it is pretty back and white in the league rules.  Am I in the wrong here? The fantrax site keeps a log of all rule changes/ overrides by commissioner so there is nothing I was trying to hide or pull the wool over people's eyes.  I think it is just a case of people being overly competitive ( they are close to me in standings) and looking for anything to complain about.  Thoughts?

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34 minutes ago, KarlJ. said:

Question for the folks on here:

In one of my fantrax leagues where I am the commissioner I have Chris Taylor and have exclusively been using him as my 2B or MI.  The other day I noticed that per our league rules he should also be listed as 3B eligible as that was his primary position played last season.  For some reason he was only listed as 2b/MI/ OF/UT even though other Fantrax leagues, ESPN, CBS, etc all list him at 3B as Primary Position.

Directly from our league rules on Fantrax;s site :20 games last season at a position or 10 games this season.   Note: If a player does not qualify for any positions based on the above selections, he will qualify at the position(s) played most in the previous MLB season. If he did not play at all last season, then the default position(s) will be used. Last season Taylor played the most at 3B.  No ambiguity here.   Obviously it is a computer glitch on our league site.  I used commissioner override to update his position status to include 3B like I have done in past for players on other teams in the instances where Fantrax had errors

 

I now have a few teams in my league chirping that I was somehow cheating because I corrected the error and as commissioner "I should have asked permission first before I corrected the position eligibility"   Note these are the same people that like to chirp on every other trade that doesn't involve them " that trade does not smell right"

I mean it is pretty back and white in the league rules.  Am I in the wrong here? The fantrax site keeps a log of all rule changes/ overrides by commissioner so there is nothing I was trying to hide or pull the wool over people's eyes.  I think it is just a case of people being overly competitive ( they are close to me in standings) and looking for anything to complain about.  Thoughts?

Well within your right to make the change, but any commish changes like this should be posted or emailed throughout the league.

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45 minutes ago, KarlJ. said:

Question for the folks on here:

In one of my fantrax leagues where I am the commissioner I have Chris Taylor and have exclusively been using him as my 2B or MI.  The other day I noticed that per our league rules he should also be listed as 3B eligible as that was his primary position played last season.  For some reason he was only listed as 2b/MI/ OF/UT even though other Fantrax leagues, ESPN, CBS, etc all list him at 3B as Primary Position.

Directly from our league rules on Fantrax;s site :20 games last season at a position or 10 games this season.   Note: If a player does not qualify for any positions based on the above selections, he will qualify at the position(s) played most in the previous MLB season. If he did not play at all last season, then the default position(s) will be used. Last season Taylor played the most at 3B.  No ambiguity here.   Obviously it is a computer glitch on our league site.  I used commissioner override to update his position status to include 3B like I have done in past for players on other teams in the instances where Fantrax had errors

 

I now have a few teams in my league chirping that I was somehow cheating because I corrected the error and as commissioner "I should have asked permission first before I corrected the position eligibility"   Note these are the same people that like to chirp on every other trade that doesn't involve them " that trade does not smell right"

I mean it is pretty back and white in the league rules.  Am I in the wrong here? The fantrax site keeps a log of all rule changes/ overrides by commissioner so there is nothing I was trying to hide or pull the wool over people's eyes.  I think it is just a case of people being overly competitive ( they are close to me in standings) and looking for anything to complain about.  Thoughts?

 

I think you were wrong to do it.  Fantrax has a contact feature where you can contact them to ask them about things.  I think this was wrong because everyone simply can't do it themselves.  If you notice something wrong on your roster it's unfair to change a player's eligibility just on yours. Especially without discussing it to the league.  I think it's also wrong to make position calls yourself like that when a computer is already doing it.  Reminds me when a friend in a basketball league was insistent on being awarded an extra block because one that should have been a block didn't count. He wanted to show me video footage. I'm like "take it up with ESPN"

 

Secondly, I do think there's some ambiguity as to what he played last year.  I'm always bad at figuring it out. Is it games played? Is it games started? Per baseball reference below he had most of his PA and AB at 2b last year.

 

 

Split G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
as 2B 5   20 19 3 6 1 1 1 7 0 0 1 5 .316 .350 .632 .982 12 1 0 0 0 0 0 .385 209 150
as 3B 5   11 11   2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 .182 .182 .182 .364 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 .250 20 -4
as SS 6   19 18 3 3 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 6 .167 .211 .333 .544 6 1 0 0 0 1 1 .250 73 48
as PH 15   15 13 2 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 .154 .267 .154 .421 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 .167 45 34

 

 

Per this page  https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/t/tayloch03-field.shtml

 

He started more games at 3b, but he played most innings at 2b.

 

So to sum:    

 

Most AB and PA: 2b,

 

Most innings played: 2b.

 

Most game started: 3b.

 

"he will qualify at the position(s) played most in the previous MLB season"

 

If that's the rule, seems like you have to go with IP which would mean he only has 2b and maybe fantrax did it right.

 

 

 

Edited by brockpapersizer
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@KarlJ. 

 

I don't think you were wrong, but you made a mistake in not being 100% transparent as commish. It's vital to a healthy league. 

I am commish on onroto and have had similar things happen. Even if it's NOT my team, I make sure everyone sees all. I'll have someone text me (as I just did earlier this week), "based on our rules, shouldn't Moncada qualify at 2B?" I looked and he was right. So I told him to post that on the message board, I'll respond, then fix. 

It's important that the league never feels anything is being done behind the scenes. I'd admit this error and make this your practice moving forward. 

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1 minute ago, brockpapersizer said:

 

I think you were wrong to do it.  Fantrax has a contact feature where you can contact them to ask them about things.  I think this was wrong because everyone simply can't do it themselves.  If you notice something wrong on your roster it's unfair to change a player's eligibility just on yours.

 

Secondly, I do think there's some ambiguity as to what he played last year.  I'm always bad at figuring it out. Is it games played? Is it games started? Per baeball reference below he had most of his PA and AB at 2b last year.

 

 

Split G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
as 2B 5   20 19 3 6 1 1 1 7 0 0 1 5 .316 .350 .632 .982 12 1 0 0 0 0 0 .385 209 150
as 3B 5   11 11   2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 .182 .182 .182 .364 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 .250 20 -4
as SS 6   19 18 3 3 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 6 .167 .211 .333 .544 6 1 0 0 0 1 1 .250 73 48
as PH 15   15 13 2 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 .154 .267 .154 .421 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 .167 45 34

 

 

Per this page  https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/t/tayloch03-field.shtml

 

He started most games at 3b, but he played most innings at 2b.

 

So to sum:    Most AB: 2b, Most innings played: 2b. Most game started: 3b.

 

"he will qualify at the position(s) played most in the previous MLB season"

 

If that's the rule, seems like you have to go with IP which would mean he only has 2b and maybe fantrax did it right.

 

 

 

It is games played. Every other fantrax league (which has the same position settings and rules) have Taylor listed at 3B. Obviously it is a computer glitch for our specific site. I have fixed position errors for players on other teams as I notice them or as they are called to my attention by the respective teams. Fantrax like other sites is not perfect as sometimes there are errors. Also the site keeps a log of all commissioner changes and can be set to email all teams of changes under team options.   I am not trying to hide anything. I just didn't think it was necessary to ask permission to correct a site error.  If people think I was wrong on that I will accept it but I certainly wasn't trying to cheat or anything

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How do you guys deal with a commish who just won't bugger off? There's a guy in my league - a league that's been running for 5 years - who is new. It's a Dynasty where you keep 20 for as long as you like. 

He moved an ace level pitcher that was hurt for a couple of "meh" pieces (top 80 players) like a month ago.

The deal was pretty lopsided, but no one said it should be overturned even when the guy getting the ace said he'd go back on it if the league thought it was unfair. 

Now everytime the guy who hit the ace chats in our group message, the commish comes in and rides his a**. The commish won't give him a chance to like... Properly chat. He can't ask a question without it being brought up. 

A few of us have spoken to the commish but he just won't change. So frustrating. 

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11 minutes ago, KarlJ. said:

It is games played. Every other fantrax league (which has the same position settings and rules) have Taylor listed at 3B. 

 

I can't admit I know where Chris Taylor qualified for at the beginning of the season on Fantrax.  If you are using fantrax default position eligibilities, I find it almost unbelievable that every fantrax league gave him 3b except yours. I've never heard of that happening.  I've heard a few times a site will mess up a position, but they mess it up for every league.  Secondly If you "know" that he was 3b in every league when the season started (a bizarre thing to know about a fringe player at the beginning of the season), how did it take you until almost August to figure out a player on your team wasn't given the proper eligibility?  Something seems off here. 

 

I do not think you were trying to cheat at all. I wouldn't have done it. That being said, if you have been fixing eligibilities for everyone else, then I don't see the problem. I just hope there is some easy uniform way to figure out where someone qualifies, because sometimes its confusing with players changing position mid games and so on.

 

 

Edited by brockpapersizer
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