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Donovan Mitchell 2017-18 Season Outlook


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5 hours ago, RipCity0 said:

 

People going crazy. It's not even close? Empty stats? lool

 

The Sixers have a better record and won both games against Utah FYI

I will just say this, I think Embiid as important if not more for their good record (see the recent injuries and record). People are going to stop simmons like what rotoworld said:

 

he Nuggets allowed him to shoot the ball and NBA teams will probably allow that to continue. Before tonight, Simmons was only 5-of-15 on his wide-open shots from beyond 10 feet, so it's not even like Simmons is taking them either. Regardless, he's not going to light it up in scoring, but he'll be a force in the other non-scoring categories. Dec 31 - 12:15 AM

 

You can't stop Mitchell by just daring him to score. Point is, Mitchell more directly carries the team on his back with scoring. Simmons is gonna need help every night. I think the ROY is up for grabs depending on how the teams fare the rest of the season.

 

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23 minutes ago, rob0403 said:

I will just say this, I think Embiid as important if not more for their good record (see the recent injuries and record). People are going to stop simmons like what rotoworld said:

 

he Nuggets allowed him to shoot the ball and NBA teams will probably allow that to continue. Before tonight, Simmons was only 5-of-15 on his wide-open shots from beyond 10 feet, so it's not even like Simmons is taking them either. Regardless, he's not going to light it up in scoring, but he'll be a force in the other non-scoring categories. Dec 31 - 12:15 AM

 

You can't stop Mitchell by just daring him to score. Point is, Mitchell more directly carries the team on his back with scoring. Simmons is gonna need help every night. I think the ROY is up for grabs depending on how the teams fare the rest of the season.

 

I disagreed with the "it's not even close" and empty stats thing. I didn't say Simmons should be 100% ROY. It's an open race. Embiid is the best C in the league(ok together with Boogie) , of course he is more important for their record. 

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Feels good to not even visit this thread anymore. You know you have a bonafide fantasy stud when these player threads become irrelevant for discussion on his outlook/credibility and only become bumped for appreciation or happiness.

 

I have him booked as a early 4th at this rate already in standard 9 cat redraft, that'll probably spike in the upcoming months based on how fast he's developed.... insane (depending on how competitive the league is, honestly wouldn't be surprised to see him be taken at RD3 even like others above have already discussed... its not even remotely crazy seeing the kind of numbers he's putting up this year)

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59 minutes ago, Tr3yball said:

Feels good to not even visit this thread anymore. You know you have a bonafide fantasy stud when these player threads become irrelevant for discussion on his outlook/credibility and only become bumped for appreciation or happiness.

 

I have him booked as a early 4th at this rate already in standard 9 cat redraft, that'll probably spike in the upcoming months based on how fast he's developed.... insane (depending on how competitive the league is, honestly wouldn't be surprised to see him be taken at RD3 even like others above have already discussed... its not even remotely crazy seeing the kind of numbers he's putting up this year)

 

I can see myself spending McCollum price for him, and at this moment I wouldn't trade Mitchell for McCollum

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On 01/01/2018 at 8:50 PM, THE_MAGIC_MAN said:

 

I can see myself spending McCollum price for him, and at this moment I wouldn't trade Mitchell for McCollum

Too late, man. It wouldn't be possible to trade for Mitchell with anyone outside top-30.

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1 minute ago, THE_MAGIC_MAN said:

 

we talking about next seasons draft and how I would gladly take Mitchell at McCollums price, I ain't saying I'm tryna trade McCollum for Mitchell right now.

Oh, sorry. Yeah, it'd be a fair price, if he keeps it up like this (I'm sure he will).

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13 minutes ago, miasma16 said:

9b5.jpg

 

It's going to be Simmons in a landslide, don't waste another second thinking about this.

 

Landslide is a very strong word. NBA.com does the rookie ladder where their analysts rank the rookies and they had Mitchell # 1 as of Dec 21st (source below, watch first 2 videos). I'm not saying you're wrong I also think Simmons will win but it is neck and neck with Mitchell and will continue to be because Mitchell is a flat out better scorer. Honestly over the last month I'd take Mitchell.

 

Our politicians above must be laughing that the ROY leader can't make a shot outside of 5 feet from the basket. 

 

http://www.nba.com/video/2017/11/30/20171130-rookie-ladder-nba#/

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33 minutes ago, miasma16 said:

Oh look, you went and wasted a second. Simmons has better numbers and plays defense. It's not close. Just enjoy your waiver wire gem and leave it at that. 

I wasted a few more second just for you :) I'm checking the last 30 days because Mitchell wasn't really getting minutes near Simmons to start the year and the last month is a more accurate representation of who he is.

 

Last 30 days stats:

 

Mitchell: 21.6/3.3/3.8 1.9 steals .4 blocks 3.1 TO on 50% shooting 

 

Simmons: 14.7/7.4/8.1/ 1.5 steals .9 blocks 4.4 TO on 51% shooting

 

you're right though it's not even close a total landslide.

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13 minutes ago, greatestmetfan said:

I wasted a few more second just for you :) I'm checking the last 30 days because Mitchell wasn't really getting minutes near Simmons to start the year and the last month is a more accurate representation of who he is.

 

Last 30 days stats:

 

Mitchell: 21.6/3.3/3.8 1.9 steals .4 blocks 3.1 TO on 50% shooting 

 

Simmons: 14.7/7.4/8.1/ 1.5 steals .9 blocks 4.4 TO on 51% shooting

 

you're right though it's not even close a total landslide.

Even in the smaller sample size that's more convenient to your argument, Simmons has better popcorn stats. Mitchell is a minor liability on defense; Simmons is one of the best defenders in the league at his position. Stop embarrassing yourself.

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16 minutes ago, greatestmetfan said:

I wasted a few more second just for you :) I'm checking the last 30 days because Mitchell wasn't really getting minutes near Simmons to start the year and the last month is a more accurate representation of who he is.

 

Last 30 days stats:

 

Mitchell: 21.6/3.3/3.8 1.9 steals .4 blocks 3.1 TO on 50% shooting 

 

Simmons: 14.7/7.4/8.1/ 1.5 steals .9 blocks 4.4 TO on 51% shooting

 

you're right though it's not even close a total landslide.

 

so because Mitchell was not getting minutes Simmons loses a month of stats? :lol:

 

Also saying Mitchell is not getting mins is not accurate as well, shouldn't be more than 5 games that his mins were low.

 

@miasma16 I don't think Mitchell is a defensive liability though, i think he is good there as well.

 

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1 minute ago, RipCity0 said:

 

so because Mitchell was not getting minutes Simmons loses a month of stats? :lol:

 

Also saying Mitchell is not getting mins is not accurate as well, shouldn't be more than 5 games that his mins were low.

 

No the above shows the last 30 days of both players... No ones "loses" any stats. In the past 30 days (approximately 15 games) those are the stats and you can determine who's been better. Also it's not just the mins it's more that Mitchell had to prove himself to take a starting job where Simmons just had it (this doesn't negate simmons at all) but Mitchells first month just isn't reflective of who he is as a player. Now that he's locked in as the Jazz' best player and ball handler we have a better understanding of what he's able to do on a nightly basis. We're going to see much of the same moving forward with a drop in FG%.

 

10 minutes ago, miasma16 said:

Stop embarrassing yourself.

lol I said I agreed it's Simmons in my first post but that it's not a landslide...chill out superstar

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40 minutes ago, miasma16 said:

Even in the smaller sample size that's more convenient to your argument, Simmons has better popcorn stats. Mitchell is a minor liability on defense; Simmons is one of the best defenders in the league at his position. Stop embarrassing yourself.

Simmons is a top 5 perimeter defender and Mitchell is top 20 based on the few advanced metrics Ive seen. 

But then again defensive metrics aren't that reliable unfortunately. Both of them pass the eye test though 

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9 hours ago, miasma16 said:

Voters literally couldn't care less about something like this.

I think it's more important than that. You gotta think twice when the best player of your choice can easily be "hacked" (I know the rules changed a year ago, but still). Simmons is a big liability in offense in today's NBA, until he develops a jump shot. There's a reason why successful teams in the league (Houston, GSW, now Cavs too I presume) rely on 3-ball or drives. Not much else. Even LeBron, who Simmons resembles in style, has 2 triples per game. 

 

The point is Simmons is great, but Mitchell is a better fit for today's league. Same reason why traditional centers are not highly regarded anymore : Is Jokic or prime-Dwight a better player? Which one would be more valuable today for teams? Another example: Is Monroe such a bad player? Nope. Reality: Nobody is interested in him.

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8 minutes ago, trusthaprocess said:

9/10 from the line yesterday, very helpful, his shot wasn't falling, but he helped elsewhere. That's valuable in fantasy. 

 thats a sign of an elite basketball player, he really only had 14 points but was nice enough to pad his stats during garbage time against the pelicans

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4 hours ago, rush007 said:

I think it's more important than that. You gotta think twice when the best player of your choice can easily be "hacked" (I know the rules changed a year ago, but still). Simmons is a big liability in offense in today's NBA, until he develops a jump shot. There's a reason why successful teams in the league (Houston, GSW, now Cavs too I presume) rely on 3-ball or drives. Not much else. Even LeBron, who Simmons resembles in style, has 2 triples per game. 

 

The point is Simmons is great, but Mitchell is a better fit for today's league. Same reason why traditional centers are not highly regarded anymore : Is Jokic or prime-Dwight a better player? Which one would be more valuable today for teams? Another example: Is Monroe such a bad player? Nope. Reality: Nobody is interested in him.

 

Mitchell is a better fit for today's league at this time, and I do think Mitchell has top ten potential, but Simmons has already shown that he has the potential of being a transcendent player that can affect the game in so many ways and this is without a jump shot. 

 

Simmons has already shown he can potentially average a triple double - Mitchell is not ever going to average a triple double.  Last night's game for example, he scored 26 without a jump shot.  Imagine what he could be WITH a jump shot.  He already has all of the tools besides the jump shot to be a great player.  Right now the league is pace and space, but things can change rather quickly (maybe him and Giannis will change that style) and could go back to fitting more toward Ben's style or Giannis' style in a few years - who knows.  

 

I love both Mitchell and Simmons, but if I was running a team and could only have one of them, I would rather have Simmons because he is a defensive problem already and in the paint offensively, he is a problem.  His vision and passing is amazing and better than Mitchell's.  Really the only thing Donovan has on him is the jump shot.  Ben's jump shot is all about confidence - once he develops the confidence in it, offensively he will be unstoppable.  

 

And in particular to the ROY race, Mitchell has closed the gap I admit, but voters don't care about where Simmons gets his points or who is a better fit for the league. Stat for stat, impact for impact, Simmons is still more impactful and the ROY right now.  

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4 hours ago, rush007 said:

I think it's more important than that. You gotta think twice when the best player of your choice can easily be "hacked" (I know the rules changed a year ago, but still). Simmons is a big liability in offense in today's NBA, until he develops a jump shot. There's a reason why successful teams in the league (Houston, GSW, now Cavs too I presume) rely on 3-ball or drives. Not much else. Even LeBron, who Simmons resembles in style, has 2 triples per game. 

 

The point is Simmons is great, but Mitchell is a better fit for today's league. Same reason why traditional centers are not highly regarded anymore : Is Jokic or prime-Dwight a better player? Which one would be more valuable today for teams? Another example: Is Monroe such a bad player? Nope. Reality: Nobody is interested in him.

Ok, there's been this rash of people that started following r/nba and think they're basketball experts. I've been a fan of the league for a long time, and am obviously enough of a nerd to care about patterns of voting for MVP, RotY, etc. None of what you're talking about has anything to do with who will win Rookie of the Year. It's points, rebounds and assists, primarily. It's team record and hype as secondaries. Again, please stop presenting cases that don't matter, Simmons would win in a walk if voting were held today. 

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2 minutes ago, miasma16 said:

Ok, there's been this rash of people that started following r/nba and think they're basketball experts. I've been a fan of the league for a long time, and am obviously enough of a nerd to care about patterns of voting for MVP, RotY, etc. None of what you're talking about has anything to do with who will win Rookie of the Year. It's points, rebounds and assists, primarily. It's team record and hype as secondaries. Again, please stop presenting cases that don't matter, Simmons would win in a walk if voting were held today. 

Haha. Great, now we're being sarcastic. NVM. I'm not claiming to be a basketball expert.

 

All that I'm saying is this: Simmons has a very obvious flaw in his skill set, while Mitchell does not. That's it. If you're valuing some stats/skills more, let people value others as well. In terms of ROY, I also think Simmons has the edge now, but IMO it's close, and that may change in the next few months.

 

Note: Last year, Brogdon (10/3/4) averaged slightly less popcorn stats than Saric (13/6/2) or Embiid (20/8/2). Embiid got hurt, but he was still eligible, and he had double the stats. It's not all about pts/rebs/assists. Circumstances matter.

 

Anyway, let's move on. Mitchell is ROY in fantasy, that's for sure. :D 

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