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A QB who can’t throw and a WR who can’t catch. Not a good fit. A perfect fit. 

Amari for me is the 2017 Gurley of WRs.   - Young incredible talent, freak of nature, pedigree coming out of college - Coming off a disaster year after a promising start to NFL career

A first rounder?? A Dallas first rounder no less?? That’s going to be a top-15 pick! The Raiders just fleeced the Cowboys.

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On 7/7/2018 at 10:38 AM, Panthers8912 said:

You’re not concerned about Gruden being insanely old school?

I don't think Gruden has ever been top 10 in rushing attempts.  He's all talk.

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15 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

I don't think Gruden has ever been top 10 in rushing attempts.  He's all talk.

 

This is going back to 1995 (also appears to include overall team rushing attempts). Also doesn't consider who had play calling duties:

 

As an OC, the 1995, 1996, and 1997 Eagles all ranked top 10 in rushing attempts

 

As a HC, which includes 1998-2001 as OAK HC and 2002-2008 as TB HC (11 total seasons), only the 1999 and 2000 Raiders ranked in the top 10 in rushing attempts. 

 

He has ranked top 10 in passing attempts three seasons as OC/HC: 1997 PHI, 2003 TB, 2008 TB

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3 hours ago, ponza88 said:

 

Why?

Really? 

 

His best finish in 3 years is 12th in 2016, but he was 15th in a PPG basis. 

 

Why on Earth would I bet that he finishes inside the top 12? Guy has shown very little in the RZ, can't seem to catch the ball, and now he's adding weight?

 

Pass. Big pass. Easy pass. 

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1 minute ago, PackerBacker555 said:

I’m high on Cooper this year

Bet you are Panama Red...

 

He is the type of guy who I could see bringing some value this year, I will be curious where he goes price wise in my two auction leagues and I could be a buyer.  Unfortunately both leagues are in Raider country so with Raider fans its tough to tell.  If I go big $ on my two RB's, he is a guy I might target as my WR1.  

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I'm not a huge believer in bounces for random statistical reasons. It seems Cooper had injuries during 2017:

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/oakland-raiders/Bolt/Derek-Carr-says-Amari-Cooper-battled-injuries-throughout-2017-NFL-season-115203731/

[Carr also went on to say that Amari battled injuries all season. 

"He would never say it to you but I'll say it to you to have his back. That man was out there giving anything he could and honestly, a lot of guys probably wouldn't have played with what he had"]

 

That explains the drop in catch rate but not really the drop in targets, which was significant. He could get some of those back, but that also depends on Bryant and Nelson.

 

So now I want to know: is he fully healthy? Or any lingering issues? Kudos to him for playing on, but if we were during the season never told about last year's injuries, can we be sure he's healthy now?

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Maybe the most polarizing player for me to rank for 2018. 

 

Pro's

First 2 seasons were really solid (not spectacular) but he was far from a bust.

Talented, still only 24, and the Raiders used a high draft pick to acquire him (so they are definitely not giving up on him yet).

His biggest comp for targets the last 2 seasons (Crabtree) is gone and been replaced by MBryant (bad showing so far in camp and may be suspended again) and 33 year old Jordy who looked washed in GB last year.

His 11 catch, 210 yard, 2TD performance against KC was epic (and I'm pretty sure he dropped another long TD that would have made it even bigger).

Gruden has a history of peppering his WR1 with a lot of targets and has constantly talked up Amari this offseason.

 

Con's

Last year was mostly dreadful.

Unbelievably he had 5 games where he was held to under 10 receiving yards!!

Was held to under 70 rec yard in 12 of his 14 games played.  This is really scary and the thing that has me most doubting his 2018 prospects.

 

At this point, I am leaning towards chalking up 2017 to a fluke/lost season due to injuries and bad play-calling and likely going to bet on the talent and change of coaching staff in OAK.  Still hard to fathom though that this guy put up such duds last season (playing hurt or not). 

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3 minutes ago, J.T. Marlin said:

Maybe the most polarizing player for me to rank for 2018. 

 

Pro's

First 2 seasons were really solid (not spectacular) but he was far from a bust.

Talented, still only 24, and the Raiders used a high draft pick to acquire him (so they are definitely not giving up on him yet).

His biggest comp for targets the last 2 seasons (Crabtree) is gone and been replaced by MBryant (bad showing so far in camp and may be suspended again) and 33 year old Jordy who looked washed in GB last year.

His 11 catch, 210 yard, 2TD performance against KC was epic (and I'm pretty sure he dropped another long TD that would have made it even bigger).

Gruden has a history of peppering his WR1 with a lot of targets and has constantly talked up Amari this offseason.

 

Con's

Last year was mostly dreadful.

Unbelievably he had 5 games where he was held to under 10 receiving yards!!

Was held to under 70 rec yard in 12 of his 14 games played.  This is really scary and the thing that has me most doubting his 2018 prospects.

 

At this point, I am leaning towards chalking up 2017 to a fluke/lost season due to injuries and bad play-calling and likely going to bet on the talent and change of coaching staff in OAK.  Still hard to fathom though that this guy put up such duds last season (playing hurt or not). 

 

 

Also:

 

Of his 680 yards, 30.9% came in one game where he got 210, along with his 2 TD.  He won you that week, performed decently in a couple others, and crushed your spirits the rest of the season.

 

Even scarier, his only other +100 yard game...came in week 17, along with another TD.  Which is another 16.9% of his yardage for the year.

 

47.8% of his total either came in one game, or for 99% of leagues, in a week it didn't count.

 

If you are in PPR, the only week he went over 5 catches was that monster 200 yard game, where he got 11 catches. 22.9% of his catches for the season came in that game.

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Sternes said:

 

 

Also:

 

Of his 680 yards, 30.9% came in one game where he got 210, along with his 2 TD.  He won you that week, performed decently in a couple others, and crushed your spirits the rest of the season.

 

Even scarier, his only other +100 yard game...came in week 17, along with another TD.  Which is another 16.9% of his yardage for the year.

 

47.8% of his total either came in one game, or for 99% of leagues, in a week it didn't count.

 

If you are in PPR, the only week he went over 5 catches was that monster 200 yard game, where he got 11 catches. 22.9% of his catches for the season came in that game.

 

 

 

 

Pretty much Jay Ajayi in 2016 and we see what he has done since. 

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3 minutes ago, oliminator123 said:

Pretty much Jay Ajayi in 2016 and we see what he has done since. 

While I wasn’t a fan of Ajayi last year, at least he was able to string a few games together a few years back and wasn’t absolutely horrid in the other ones.

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Cooper's first 2 years are only matched by some elite names in the history of the NFL. His QB broke his leg towards the end of his 2nd season and while recovering from that dealt with a back injury for most of last year. I'm willing to bet on him, Carr and the new offense at his current ADP, I currently hope to own him wherever I draft whether it be front, middle or back it'll just be easiest at the back.

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1 hour ago, turner46 said:

Cooper's first 2 years are only matched by some elite names in the history of the NFL. His QB broke his leg towards the end of his 2nd season and while recovering from that dealt with a back injury for most of last year. I'm willing to bet on him, Carr and the new offense at his current ADP, I currently hope to own him wherever I draft whether it be front, middle or back it'll just be easiest at the back.

 

His first 2 years were good, but not great (neither was a WR1 season). They were hyped so much because of his age. 

 

I'm expecting him to get forcefed targets this year. 

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Agree that he’ll get a lot of targets. And aren’t we supposed to chase volume in fantasy? Or atleast that’s what the nerds say. 

 

Im also inclined to believe that cooper and Carr both played injured last year. I’m not sure what else would cause such a big drop off from his first 2 seasons. Wish his adp was lower (Lol I say this about everyone). I’d probably start to consider him in the mid 4th

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8 hours ago, Panthers8912 said:

Agree that he’ll get a lot of targets. And aren’t we supposed to chase volume in fantasy? Or atleast that’s what the nerds say. 

 

Im also inclined to believe that cooper and Carr both played injured last year. I’m not sure what else would cause such a big drop off from his first 2 seasons. Wish his adp was lower (Lol I say this about everyone). I’d probably start to consider him in the mid 4th

 

I took him at 4.10 in a June high-stakes draft (12-team PPR). Anywhere in the 4th rd seems like a steal to me. 

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On 8/7/2018 at 10:48 AM, Boudewijn said:

I'm not a huge believer in bounces for random statistical reasons. It seems Cooper had injuries during 2017:

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/oakland-raiders/Bolt/Derek-Carr-says-Amari-Cooper-battled-injuries-throughout-2017-NFL-season-115203731/

[Carr also went on to say that Amari battled injuries all season. 

"He would never say it to you but I'll say it to you to have his back. That man was out there giving anything he could and honestly, a lot of guys probably wouldn't have played with what he had"]

 

That explains the drop in catch rate but not really the drop in targets, which was significant. He could get some of those back, but that also depends on Bryant and Nelson.

 

So now I want to know: is he fully healthy? Or any lingering issues? Kudos to him for playing on, but if we were during the season never told about last year's injuries, can we be sure he's healthy now?

 

Apart from—or in addition to—Carr’s health, the question of Jordy Nelson looms, and the answer might disinter the name Edgar Bennett: “In February 2011, Bennett was named wide receivers coach [in Green Bay]. In February 2015, Packers head coach Mike McCarthy promoted Bennett to offensive coordinator. In January 2018, Jon Gruden hired Bennett to be wide receivers coach for the Oakland Raiders.” So, the question for this thread to consider may be, who’s the better value pick, the WR who saw a major loss in target percentage last season and who’s going in the 4th? Or an old old round 8 WR with an exceptional tie to the WR coach, an ancient WR who has not been fantasy-relevant in like forever, where relevant = top 2 and forever = 20 months ago? 

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