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Josh Gordon 2018 Outlook


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[We are re-opening this thread on a provisional basis, with an increased focus on keeping the discussion on topic and manageable.  This means that if your comment is not 100% germane to Josh Gordon's fantasy outlook, it is subject to removal, and you will be subject to warning and/or suspension of posting privileges.  There will be no courtesy warnings.  Please contribute to a meaningful fantasy football discussion, or take your commentary elsewhere.]

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1 hour ago, devaster said:

After watching Hilton in the Pro Bowl game today you have to wonder about the talent of Brissett. Sure they were playing touch-tackle, but he still made a ridiculous catch over Patrick Peterson that should have been an interception. And showed some nice moves splitting defenders.

 

Some receivers tank without a decent QB throwing to them though. Look at AB's games without Big Ben.

It's the Pro Bowl. I think that's the main take away here. Beyond that I totally agree that TY is a very good, if not great receiver. It definitely helps having Luck as his starting QB.

 

Admittedly even if I am right about Brissett being a starter he will never be as good as Luck. But I do think he could be a good starter in the league in the right situation.

 

Back to pairing Brissett with Gordon, one thing I forgot to mention was Brissett's prowess with deep throws, which would be especially beneficial to Gordon.

 

https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2017/11/21/indianapolis-colts-brissett-deep-passer-rating-pro-football-focus/

 

 

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2 hours ago, pikerbkb said:

It's the Pro Bowl. I think that's the main take away here. Beyond that I totally agree that TY is a very good, if not great receiver. It definitely helps having Luck as his starting QB.

 

Admittedly even if I am right about Brissett being a starter he will never be as good as Luck. But I do think he could be a good starter in the league in the right situation.

 

Back to pairing Brissett with Gordon, one thing I forgot to mention was Brissett's prowess with deep throws, which would be especially beneficial to Gordon.

 

https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2017/11/21/indianapolis-colts-brissett-deep-passer-rating-pro-football-focus/

 

 

Shouldn't it have also benefited Hilton?

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6 hours ago, Gohawks said:

Shouldn't it have also benefited Hilton?

 

There is so much left out of context because people are comparing Hiltons 2017 with a 1st yr starting QB who never played in the Colts offense vs his 2016  best year with a  a prob bowl QB who he has played with for 5 seasons. let's get realistic here. guys are comparing apples to oranges.

 

2012 Hilton  90 targets 50 catches 861yds 7 td  --rookie hilton+rookie Luck after a full offseason working with each other

2017 Hilton  109 targets 57 catches 966 yds 4td  - Brisset being handed a Colts playbook and uniform as he is being driven from the airport to his 1st game

 

yeah i'm ok with Brisset over kizer being the browns QB passing to 6'4 225 4.34 speed Josh Gordon with a massive catch radius instead of the 5'9 180lb ty hilton with a small catch radius

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7 hours ago, dashoe said:

 

There is so much left out of context because people are comparing Hiltons 2017 with a 1st yr starting QB who never played in the Colts offense vs his 2016  best year with a  a prob bowl QB who he has played with for 5 seasons. let's get realistic here. guys are comparing apples to oranges.

 

2012 Hilton  90 targets 50 catches 861yds 7 td  --rookie hilton+rookie Luck after a full offseason working with each other

2017 Hilton  109 targets 57 catches 966 yds 4td  - Brisset being handed a Colts playbook and uniform as he is being driven from the airport to his 1st game

 

Your gonna use Hiltons rookie season when he started 1 game.  You don't think Hilton has gotten better over the years??  Also the argument of Brissett getting thrown in to the starting job would be valid if he didn't get worse as the league had more game tape on him.  

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6 minutes ago, youngrice said:

Your gonna use Hiltons rookie season when he started 1 game.  You don't think Hilton has gotten better over the years??  Also the argument of Brissett getting thrown in to the starting job would be valid if he didn't get worse as the league had more game tape on him.  

 

 You used his best season after 5yrs as a pro with a pro bowl QB to compare him with essentially a 1st yr starter with no offseason work and time to build rapport, His rookie year he still played in every game

 

So ok we will look at   2013 where he was a 2nd yr player with a 2nd year pro bowl QB  139 targets 82 catches 1083 yds 5td

 or we could just do a 5yr avg of 130 targets 75 catch 1172 yds 6td

2017 Hilton  109 targets 57 catches 966 yds 4td

 

So basically it looks like TY is missing those 30 extra targets to help his yard totals but it pretty much looks like he is in line with hist worst year and not ridiculously far off his avg production given the colts had to logically limit their entire play calling to accommodoate a QB learning a new the systems with no preparation because you are talking about an offense that was built around Andrew Luck to run.

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On 1/28/2018 at 9:08 PM, joshua18 said:

 

OBJ was an ankle break not an Achilles. 

 

Gordon over OBJ in any circumstance is laughable.

 

 

My bad, it was Chiefs WR Chris Conley that ruptured his Achilles that week.

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Overall Grade: C-

Josh Gordon: A

18 receptions for 335 yards, one touchdown and 18.6 yards per reception

Corey Coleman: C+

23 receptions for 305 yards, two touchdowns and 13.3 yards per reception

Sammie Coates: D

Six receptions for 70 yards and 11.7 yards per reception

Rashard Higgins: C

27 receptions for 312 yards, two touchdowns and 11.6 yards per reception 

Ricardo Louis: C 

27 receptions for 357 yards and 13.2 yards per reception 

Kasen Williams: D+ 

Nine receptions for 84 yards and 9.3 yards per reception

Kenny Britt: F

18 receptions for 233 yards, two touchdowns, 12.9 yards per reception

Bryce Treggs: D+

Five receptions for 79 yards and 15.8 yards per reception

Jordan Leslie: INC

One reception for 26 yards and 26 yards per reception

 

 

I didnt realiaze how bad and how many wr's that the Browns cycled through for the entire season. They really need to invest in a QB and clean house and get another vet wr on the roster to complement Josh.

Coleman just didnt impress me as the guy to pick up the slack.

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Despite not playing for two-plus seasons, Josh Gordon displayed talent in the final five weeks of the 2017 NFL season. He’s showed he’s still a reliable pass catcher. According to Pro Football Focus Elite, he only dropped one out of 19 catchable passes and caught all five catchable deep passes that were targeted to him.

 

Please get Josh a decent QB and I will draft him above all other wr's. :mellow:

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On 1/28/2018 at 11:19 PM, Gohawks said:

Shouldn't it have also benefited Hilton?

If KY Hilton was so great I could argue that he should have helped Brissett's stats, but Hilton had trouble beating double coverage. So in actuality Brissett had his production hurt by Hilton's poor play and Hilton was exposed as an overrated and undersized WR. Makes about the same amount of sense I suppose. 

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On 1/28/2018 at 8:41 PM, pikerbkb said:

 

 

Back to pairing Brissett with Gordon, one thing I forgot to mention was Brissett's prowess with deep throws, which would be especially beneficial to Gordon.

 

https://coltswire.usatoday.com/2017/11/21/indianapolis-colts-brissett-deep-passer-rating-pro-football-focus/

 

 

I see your link failed to have his full season ranking.  You do realize the season is 16 games not 9?  

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6 hours ago, dashoe said:

 

But he had Terrelle Pryor, the training camp highlight phenom right? :D

 

TP was one of my biggest misses of the season. 

 

But to be fair it's been reported that he injured his ankle in the week 2 game vs the Rams (eventually had surgery on it) so at least that explains why his playing time decreased so rapidly after that point. 

 

Sounds a lot like Marvin Jones 2016.

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30 minutes ago, 96mnc said:

 

TP was one of my biggest misses of the season. 

 

But to be fair it's been reported that he injured his ankle in the week 2 game vs the Rams (eventually had surgery on it) so at least that explains why his playing time decreased so rapidly after that point. 

 

Sounds a lot like Marvin Jones 2016.

 

 

TP should tell Hue he wants to come back he is actually better than most of their current wr roster and could be a legit complement to Josh as the 2nd or 3rd option. although I could see a case for the jets giving him a prove it deal

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15 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

 

TP should tell Hue he wants to come back he is actually better than most of their current wr roster and could be a legit complement to Josh as the 2nd or 3rd option. although I could see a case for the jets giving him a prove it deal

 

Interestingly enough reportedly  the Browns tried to trade for TP at the deadline this year...and Washington said no. 

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17 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

 

TP should tell Hue he wants to come back he is actually better than most of their current wr roster and could be a legit complement to Josh as the 2nd or 3rd option. although I could see a case for the jets giving him a prove it deal

didnt TP turn down like 30 mil from the browns? 

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ya here it is 

 

The Browns offered Pryor a $32 million deal over four years, $17 million guaranteed. I'm told Pryor wanted a four-year deal averaging $13 million -- or $52 million total. Not sure how much guaranteed.

The Browns thought that was outrageous, as it would make him one of the highest-paid receivers in the NFL. They never had any intention of offering him the $15 million franchise tag for 2016. 

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2 minutes ago, Flyers_28 said:

didnt TP turn down like 30 mil from the browns? 

 

He did.  He bet on himself on a one year prove it deal (like Jeffery) and unfortunately for him he got hurt.  It happens.

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12 minutes ago, psygolf said:

Very little talk about Gordon being on a new team next year, why?

 

 They have him locked up tight he is still on his rookie comp and is a RFA in 2019 and a FA in 2020. 

There is zero incentive to trade him before 2019 given his contract is peanuts

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