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New York Jets 2019 Outlook


Iron-cock
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On 5/19/2019 at 5:38 AM, Boudewijn said:

I have read before that Manning is interested in a front office position. I just wouldn't know why he would choose the Jets when he can simply walk into any of the 32 teams, tell the owner "I would like that desk over there" and they would happily give him everything and include free foot massages.

 

The Jets are a pretty poor job for a new GM to walk into.  The GM has control over the roster, but both the GM and the Coach report to the owner.  They just hired Gase, so you're stuck with him, and you are stuck with the moves that MacCagnan made this year.  Basically you'll have limited time and resources to clean up a few fires before the season starts.  You get to do that in the most critical/cynical media market in the world, and you get to deal with Bill Belichick's Patriots being in your division.

It's the kind of job that attracts the John Idzik's of the world...people who wouldn't normally be GMs so they'd consider a crappy setup.

I can't see Peyton Manning coming to GM the Jets unless he really LOVES Adam Gase.  Which he might:

  https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/peyton-manning-thinks-his-former-oc-adam-gase-is-a-good-fit-for-jets-sam-darnold/

Other quarterbacks are positive too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0Lu33OnWjc

A bit more background:

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/1/9/18176291/adam-gase-new-york-jets-head-coach-sam-darnold

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/02/sports/football/an-unconventional-path-to-scripting-the-broncos-offense.html

 

 

 

 

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23 minutes ago, dashoe said:

He has enough to be a part of an ownership group. there are only 12 teams who have outright owners, the rest have ownership groups or multi-family ownership.

 

Right, but the controlling owner has at least 30%.  Assuming an NFL team is worth 1 billon (give or take), Peyton would need to put up 300 Million to have a controlling interest.  He's worth about 200M.  The NFL player who could probably pull it off is Tom Brady, as long as Giselle is kicking money in too (they're worth about 600M).

 

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54 minutes ago, Iron-cock said:

 

Right, but the controlling owner has at least 30%.  Assuming an NFL team is worth 1 billon (give or take), Peyton would need to put up 300 Million to have a controlling interest.  He's worth about 200M.  The NFL player who could probably pull it off is Tom Brady, as long as Giselle is kicking money in too (they're worth about 600M).

 

He made 249 million from football alone. That doesn't include endorsements and whatever other business ventures he's taken. He could pony up 300

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1 hour ago, Iron-cock said:

 

Right, but the controlling owner has at least 30%.  Assuming an NFL team is worth 1 billon (give or take), Peyton would need to put up 300 Million to have a controlling interest.  He's worth about 200M.  The NFL player who could probably pull it off is Tom Brady, as long as Giselle is kicking money in too (they're worth about 600M).

 

I didnt stipulate "controlling" owner, I stated owner and then maybe he takes the GM job as part of the the deal.  I think the NFL would love to have Peyton as an owner and face of a team in some fashion.

I also think in terms of the 30%  stake it can be some combination of cash+debt but don't quote me.  I remember when haslam brought the browns he didnt have the 'cash" so  he had his corporation issue debt and pay him some sort of 'dividend" with the proceeds which was sufficient for the cash requirement. 

Financial engineering at it's best🤣

Edited by dashoe
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  • 1 month later...
29 minutes ago, bomont said:

So back to the players....

I like Bell as a "if I don't get the top RBs" option to save money in the auction draft. No other Jet interests me besides Anderson as a late late flyer.

Good luck with that. I saw Bell just go at #3 in a mock.

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I've seen Bell rated as high as #5 ahead of DJ.  And after thinking about it, why not?  I think Bell is the more skilled player.  They both play in presumed average offenses but offenses schemed by Gase and Klingsbury, so at least that's something. Bell essentially had a year off to rest his body, and we saw in the past that AP got it done when he took a year off because of his whipping incident.  DJ had the wrist injury two years ago, we were all expecting great things last year because it wasn't a lower body injury, and he sort of underwhelmed for most of the year, although the puzzling playcalling could be responsible for some of that.

What's the mood like in NYC/NJ?  There seems to be some small hope for optimism.  I don't like Darnold and his big head and big hair.  But he does seem like he has the physical tools and hopefully quarterback guru Gase can work some magic.

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6 hours ago, CooL said:

Bell essentially had a year off to rest his body, and we saw in the past that AP got it done when he took a year off

True.

 

Quote

quarterback guru Gase 

uh 

what?

Outside of one incredible year with Manning, who could make any coach look good (and has), Gase hasn't done jack with any offense. In fairness what he had to work with wasn't at Manning's level, but if he was such a guru, I think his offenses would have this great track record. I don't get how people see Gase as some great offensive mind.

I like Bell fine if I don't get one of the top top guys but that's it. I think his problem will be getting keyed on a lot.

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14 hours ago, bomont said:

uh 

what?

Outside of one incredible year with Manning, who could make any coach look good (and has), Gase hasn't done jack with any offense. In fairness what he had to work with wasn't at Manning's level, but if he was such a guru, I think his offenses would have this great track record. I don't get how people see Gase as some great offensive mind.

For the casual fan who probably hears this "quarterback guru" moniker for Gase repeatedly, it would not be surprising for somebody to think that he is overrated and somehow he has fooled the entire league repeatedly into thinking he is some offensive genius.  And though he may have never won a Super Bowl and aside from Manning never worked with a HOF talent, you can't argue with his results and track record.  Just because he hasn't vaulted his QB and offense to #1 in the league every year, it doesn't mean he hasn't gotten results.  I think recency bias of having Cutler and Tannehill affects how some people think of him.

https://www.ganggreennation.com/2019/1/10/18176952/looking-at-adam-gases-history-with-quarterbacks-new-york-jets-head-coach

 

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6 hours ago, CooL said:

Just because he hasn't vaulted his QB and offense to #1 in the league every year,

IIRC he hasn't come close ANY year outside of Manning's, and even the guy who wrote that article admits he's doing a semi-fluff piece, using statistics to try and paint an optimistic picture of Gase, who even he hated as a Jet hire.

I wouldn't say he's overrated though, since so few seem to rate him very high. And yeah I can easily argue with his very spotty results and track record. 

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22 hours ago, bomont said:

Outside of one incredible year with Manning, who could make any coach look good (and has), Gase hasn't done jack with any offense

 

Tim Tebow had his career year in the NFL with Gase as his QB coach.

Peyton Manning had his career year in the NFL with Gase as his OC.

Ryan Tannehill had his career year in the NFL with Gase as his HC.

Jay Cutler was close to having his career year in the NFL with Gase as his OC, he probably had his best TD/INT year with him.

Gase does have a track record of getting the most out of his QBs.  I'd be thrilled if he were my team's QB coach.  He's gotten the best out of the worst, and the best out of the best.

Can he be a successful head coach?  We'll see.  

 

Edited by Iron-cock
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7 hours ago, CooL said:

 And though he may have never won a Super Bowl and aside from Manning never worked with a HOF talent

 

I agree with your post, but I had to pick this line out because it's a huge understatement.  His other QB's were Tannehill who spent half his college time at WR, Tebow and Cutler.  They could be a cast for a sitcom about CFL level quarterbacks.  Cutler had everything but the right attitude.  Tebow had nothing except the right attitude, and Tannehill should be a WR for the Patriots.

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2 minutes ago, bomont said:

You're playing the same word games that guy in the article was. And he isn't simply a QB coach now, he's the HC. The point is he wasn't a good hire for the Jets IMO. 

 

Those "Word Games" I posted are called facts.

I don't have a strong opinion on Gase as being a good head coach, I never thought his teams underperformed in Miami.  In fact they might have outperformed their talent in 2016.  Also take a look at what he got out of Matt Moore in 2016...I suppose that's just another "word game" too. 

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I never said they weren't facts. They simply aren't saying much and are cherry-picked words trying to make him sound better than he is...that's what I mean by word games (for example "Tim Tebow's best season" as if that's saying much of anything) etc. Regardless this discussion isn't worth continuing, I'm out...you want to think he's an offensive guru, g/l with that

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9 hours ago, CooL said:

And though he may have never won a Super Bowl and aside from Manning never worked with a HOF talent, you can't argue with his results and track record.  

I was absolutely going to argue with his track record, because I had looked at it a bit, but (quote from your article):

"Each of the four teams Gase left scored fewer points per game the season after he left them than they did in his final season with them.

Four of the five times Gase was promoted to either quarterbacks coach, offensive coordinator, or head coach, Gase’s team improved its scoring average over their previous season."

Ok, that is impressive, and that was actually going to be the stat I was going to compile. I'll also already claim the same is going to happen with the Dolphins 18 vs 19, because there is no way they're going to repeat 8 wins.

I came into this thread 20 minutes ago with a very negative opinion of Gase, but I admit I'm more open minded now.

Edited by Boudewijn
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On 6/26/2019 at 5:25 PM, Iron-cock said:

I don't have a strong opinion on Gase as being a good head coach, I never thought his teams underperformed in Miami.  In fact they might have outperformed their talent in 2016.

the problem i have with gase has more to do with his personality than his productivity. offensive line aside, gase has the team/players in place for a successful season. i just hope he doesn't create some kind of discord with le'veon bell. as you can see from the subsequent chart, gase's kundalini gland is in conflict with his overall shakra rotation:

giphy.gif

On 6/26/2019 at 6:37 PM, Boudewijn said:

I came into this thread 20 minutes ago with a very negative opinion of Gase, but I admit I'm more open minded now.

give gase some more time, he may close that mind of yours up.

gase has shown offensive initiative. my only hope is that gase stays away from the defense: the jets defense is primed for some fantastic results (though the value of its IDP players may take hits across the board). as long as they mix quinnen williams up a bit, don't limit him to NT, i expect the D to challenge any offense. and adams may be the best safety in the business.

Adams_Gronk_breakup_1.gif

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Gase sucks. He has always underutilized playmakers in favor of safe players. 

 

The reason he had Ryan tannehill as QB for so long was HIM. He gets his guys and he runs with them even though they're not good. 

 

Everyone knew Ryan T wasn't an NFL caliber starting QB. So what did they do... They extended him in hopes of being mediocre instead of winning with the right pieces. 

 

He's a loser. He will fail with the Jets. But the reality is once Brady leaves he can back his way into division wins and therefore playoff appearances and look OK when he's not. 

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19 minutes ago, Dreams And Dwightmares said:

Gase sucks. He has always underutilized playmakers in favor of safe players. 

 

The reason he had Ryan tannehill as QB for so long was HIM. He gets his guys and he runs with them even though they're not good. 

 

Everyone knew Ryan T wasn't an NFL caliber starting QB. So what did they do... They extended him in hopes of being mediocre instead of winning with the right pieces. 

 

He's a loser. He will fail with the Jets. But the reality is once Brady leaves he can back his way into division wins and therefore playoff appearances and look OK when he's not. 

don't hold back. tell us how you really feel

giphy.gif

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10 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

don't hold back. tell us how you really feel

giphy.gif

 

I know you're a Jets fan, get ready to enjoy life of mediocrity hell once Brady retires. 

 

9-7 division titles so you make the playoffs and get beat by 20 points cause you never really belonged and then you get a mediocre draft pick. 

 

I've been there. Houston Texans under BOB. At least our GM on his way out snatched Watson instead of the next 6'6 immobile POS. 

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  • 1 month later...
23 minutes ago, Iron-cock said:

 

 

 

 

snuff, salts, blow, horse----the man is under a lot of pressure and possesses underdeveloped coaching skills. he's entitled to a little me-time.

i won't judge him for sniffing whatever he's sniffing

but i will say the beard is a step in the right direction

Adam_Gase_Smelling_Salts-e1565348590680.

Screen-Shot-2019-08-08-at-70928-PM-72f9e

 

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