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3 hours ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Then tell official baseball historians that.  Because Tony LaRussa invented the term "closer" and Eck was the first one according to them.  Before that ALL relievers that got saves were also former starters.  That is no new news.  But the  ewas no "closer" until Tony LaRussa came along.

 

You said LaRussa invented the concept, and I assume that to be the concept of having a reliever come in and finish or close a game with a lead, whether that is one inning or multiple innings. I don’t really care what historians have to say (I don’t mean that disrespectfully towards you), because the concept was around long before Eck. The term might have been invented by LaRussa, but the concept was not. 

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7 minutes ago, hailtoyourvictor said:

 

You think he’s the closer long term?

 

Would Atlanta give up on him as a starter so soon? 

Frankly, this is probably all moot because Shane Greene may be in the ATL sooner than later. The Braves pen is a trainwreck, and it needs stabilization. I’m not convinced Greene is the answer, but we’ll probably find out. 

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3 minutes ago, Flyman75 said:

 

Would Atlanta give up on him as a starter so soon? 

Frankly, this is probably all moot because Shane Greene may be in the ATL sooner than later. The Braves pen is a trainwreck, and it needs stabilization. I’m not convinced Greene is the answer, but we’ll probably find out. 

 

I don't think Atlanta has given up on him as a starter.  However, he's in the bullpen now and similar to Hicks' last year I could see a scenario where he continues to do well enough.  I don't have any particular insight just a viewpoint.  I am in a holds league so would be elated if he continued in a set up role...

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It seems pretty clear the Braves still hope Toussaint can be a solid SP. Probably the same for Newcomb, which would be another reason Jackson got the save today.

Speaking of which, I don't think it's entirely clear that Luke Jackson has the job. He came into a tie game in the 12th and got the W. But Webb, Blevins, and Toussaint all came into a tie game from the 8th-11th as well.

I mean sure, Luke looks like the guy to own again after today. But it's not like they specifically saved him until they had the lead either. And there are clearly other guys on the team and off the team (Greene and/or Kimbrel) who could end up taking the job.

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LaRussa is responsible for the rise of the loogy, one pitcher per batter,  multiple relievers per inning, etc.

 

He's the reason the 7th and 8th innings can take 30 minutes each sometimes.

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11 hours ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Then tell official baseball historians that.  Because Tony LaRussa invented the term "closer" and Eck was the first one according to them.  Before that ALL relievers that got saves were also former starters.  That is no new news.  But the  ewas no "closer" until Tony LaRussa came along.

 

What about the Cubs with Sutter, then Lee Smith?

Eck was a former starter turned reliever as well.  The Cubs had guys that only closed.

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Brennan or Newcomb who has the better shot at saves?

I feel like Elias is pretty garbage and Brennan could take that job.

Jackson has been solid, though Newcomb's stopped walking people since he went to the pen.

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when Kimbrel does sign is it absolute that he would only sign on a team to be the closer? or would he sign with whoever gives him the most money even if it's a team that already has an established closer?

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22 minutes ago, SpecialFNK said:

when Kimbrel does sign is it absolute that he would only sign on a team to be the closer? or would he sign with whoever gives him the most money even if it's a team that already has an established closer?

I think he’s closing. And if it’s the Nats (Doolittle has said he’d be happy to move), Braves, Cubs, or Twins, it’s no question. Probably takes out the Mets. Not sure what other situation he’d go and NOT close.

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3 minutes ago, Backdoor Slider said:

...Not sure what other situation he’d go and NOT close.

 

Not sure because he wouldn’t go to a lot of teams or because he’s definitely better than what they have?

I can think of a lot of teams that he wouldn’t necessarily close on if he were suddenly added to the roster. 

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2 minutes ago, Fiveohnine said:

 

Not sure because he wouldn’t go to a lot of teams or because he’s definitely better than what they have?

I can think of a lot of teams that he wouldn’t necessarily close on if he were suddenly added to the roster. 

Yankees, Mets and Astros are the only ones I could come up with...

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1 hour ago, swfcdan said:

Brennan or Newcomb who has the better shot at saves?

I feel like Elias is pretty garbage and Brennan could take that job.

Jackson has been solid, though Newcomb's stopped walking people since he went to the pen.

 

 

I would think Brennan....take a look at Diekman if you are speculating on next man up in a messy bullpen.

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4 minutes ago, Backdoor Slider said:

I think he’s closing. And if it’s the Nats (Doolittle has said he’d be happy to move), Braves, Cubs, or Twins, it’s no question. Probably takes out the Mets. Not sure what other situation he’d go and NOT close.

 

I don't know what teams have said they were interested or not, or have/don't have the money.

Houston? LA Dodgers? (don't think they want to spend the money), NY Mets? NY Yankees? (unlikely with the names in their bullpen?), San Diego? St.Louis?

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21 minutes ago, smeeze said:

Yankees, Mets and Astros are the only ones I could come up with...

Dodgers too. There were some reports a few weeks ago linking Kimbrel to LA. 

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23 minutes ago, murraygd13 said:

The Royals have 5 saves on the year..another 7 blown saves...who ever their "closer" is will be lucky to get another 10-15 the rest of the season.

Those 10-15 could win you a season.

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1 hour ago, duke of queens said:

Those 10-15 could win you a season.

Or the stats that a good pitcher accumulates instead of starting the Royals "closer" could win you the season.  I've had Ian Kennedy in my lineup for the last 3 weeks and he's pitched 4 innings and 2 strikeouts.  I could be using that spot for a starter to stream or a middle relief guy who is going to get me K's, possibly wins and better ERA and ratios.

 

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53 minutes ago, murraygd13 said:

Or the stats that a good pitcher accumulates instead of starting the Royals "closer" could win you the season.  I've had Ian Kennedy in my lineup for the last 3 weeks and he's pitched 4 innings and 2 strikeouts.  I could be using that spot for a starter to stream or a middle relief guy who is going to get me K's, possibly wins and better ERA and ratios.

 

Or that spot starter/MR could blow up and ruin your ratios. We can make a lot of assumptions.

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