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Ronald Jones 2019 Outlook


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3 hours ago, wideopen21 said:

True, but there are also some really nice gifs of Ronald Jones running all over real college defenses, not Sam Houston/Delaware etc..

Gifs? lol

 

In 2017 he averaged 2.6 ypc vs Texas, 2.7 ypc vs Notre Dame, 3.4 ypc vs Ohio State. 

 

The rest were pretty average.

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5 hours ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

 

the backfield is more than just barber / jones. given an opportunity, we might see someone else emerging. bruce anderson has a decent shot if given the touches.

https://www.bucsnation.com/2019/5/19/18631370/what-do-tampa-bay-buccaneers-have-bruce-anderson-north-dakota-state-university-2019-05-19

 

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Division 8 domination 

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1 hour ago, hard1 said:

Division 8 domination 

 

6 hours ago, wideopen21 said:

True, but there are also some really nice gifs of Ronald Jones running all over real college defenses, not Sam Houston/Delaware etc..

 

while i'm the first to admit that rashad penny faced second-rate talent when putting up outstanding numbers for san diego state, i've found that the eye-test is a solid factor when predicting NFL potential. from what i've seen of ronald jones and peyton barber, i don't think it's overboard to suggest the backfield is not limited to these two, with one of these guys guaranteed to emerge as RB1. bruce anderson could surprise, and i like the way he runs (and catches). and bruce arians and lefwich like andre ellington. you see two backs; i see four.

it takes a discerning eye but first you have to keep both eyes open; some solid NFL players came from nowhere schools:

danny woodhead attended chadron state (you don't even know where that is)
malcolm butler went to school in alabama, but it was western alabama university
big ben played college ball at miami... that's miami of ohio
khalil mack wreaked havoc as a buffalo bull (that's university of buffalo)
eastern illinois produced both tony romo and jimmy garoppolo

and carson wentz commanded the offense of north dakota state... the same program that produced bruce anderson...

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9 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

danny woodhead attended chadron state (you don't even know where that is)

I didn't even know Chadron was a state, but I'm guessing it's on Tatooine.

(Or, now that I've googled it, probably more like Ice planet Hoth.)

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41 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

 

while i'm the first to admit that rashad penny faced second-rate talent when putting up outstanding numbers for san diego state, i've found that the eye-test is a solid factor when predicting NFL potential. from what i've seen of ronald jones and peyton barber, i don't think it's overboard to suggest the backfield is not limited to these two, with one of these guys guaranteed to emerge as RB1. bruce anderson could surprise, and i like the way he runs (and catches). and bruce arians and lefwich like andre ellington. you see two backs; i see four.

it takes a discerning eye but first you have to keep both eyes open; some solid NFL players came from nowhere schools:

danny woodhead attended chadron state (you don't even know where that is)
malcolm butler went to school in alabama, but it was western alabama university
big ben played college ball at miami... that's miami of ohio
khalil mack wreaked havoc as a buffalo bull (that's university of buffalo)
eastern illinois produced both tony romo and jimmy garoppolo

and carson wentz commanded the offense of north dakota state... the same program that produced bruce anderson...

 

For every Danny Woodhead there are a hundred guys that never make it. Bruce Anderson could surprise, he could also be cut.

The point was that if the Bucs truly didn't have faith in Barber/Jones they likely would have used one of their 8 draft picks on a RB or signed one of the decent FA RBs for cheap.

 

 

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10 hours ago, wideopen21 said:

 

For every Danny Woodhead there are a hundred guys that never make it. Bruce Anderson could surprise, he could also be cut.

The point was that if the Bucs truly didn't have faith in Barber/Jones they likely would have used one of their 8 draft picks on a RB or signed one of the decent FA RBs for cheap.

 

Bingo-  Bruce Anderson is a depth pick who will be fortunate to make the 53.  For every unlikely success story there are many more who bounce around practice squads for a few years.    Not to completely write him off...but he’s not their 2018 second round pick with explosive ability that they specifically targeted.  

 

FWIW Jones has been one of the Bucs best players so far in OTAS/minicamp.  humble attitude, worked his tail off in the offseason.  Big time opportunity coming-    Let’s see if he makes the most of it.   

 

 

 

 

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49 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

Bingo-  Bruce Anderson is a depth pick who will be fortunate to make the 53.  For every unlikely success story there are many more who bounce around practice squads for a few years.    Not to completely write him off...but he’s not their 2018 second round pick with explosive ability that they specifically targeted.

 

my original post was simply to point out that those viewing the bucs as a two-man backfield where one will emerge is short-sighted. true, bruce anderson may not make the 53. but the kid has talent, regardless of lack of pedigree. i'm not saying bruce anderson will achieve the ranks of priest holmes and arian foster (or breida?), but all were UDFA, as was phillip lindsay (who won the job away from #71 pick overall royce freeman). pedigree might be more important when a coach has something to prove, but arians did not target incumbent ronald jones. and the "no way will a round 7 sophomore start over pick #27 rashaad penny" discourse is further evidence that talent surfaces. arians did target bruce anderson in free agency, however. and he targeted andre ellington when he became the cardinals' head coach in 2013... and now again when as bucs' head coach six years later.

when ronald jones was "on" in college, he showed some explosiveness. when ro-jo was on the field as a pro, he seemed tepid; to me, ronald jones has failed to show NFL-level vision. maybe through solid coaching he can grow regarding vision. look at how ro-jo ignores the giant-sized hole up the middle and instead runs into traffic:

giphy.gif

could be a 54-yard TD run for a better RB

11 hours ago, wideopen21 said:

 

For every Danny Woodhead there are a hundred guys that never make it. Bruce Anderson could surprise, he could also be cut.

The point was that if the Bucs truly didn't have faith in Barber/Jones they likely would have used one of their 8 draft picks on a RB or signed one of the decent FA RBs for cheap.

 

bruce arians might argue that in his claiming of andre ellington in free agency, he has signed "one of the decent FA RBs." he also might say the same thing of his acquisition of bruce anderson.

the bucs spent 6 of their 8 draft picks on defense because their defense was among the worst in the league. landing bunting, dean, and edwards for the secondary was excellent drafting. offloading kwon alexander (who only played 18 games in the last two seasons) and picking up an even better (IMO) LSU linebacker in devin white was brilliant. drafting an RB when several talented remain undrafted (ozigbo, james williams, and bruce anderson) also seems like a good move from the front office.

all i'm suggesting is that the "is it barber or jones?" question or even "when will ro-jo take over?" question is myopic.

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36 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

my original post was simply to point out that those viewing the bucs as a two-man backfield where one will emerge is short-sighted. true, bruce anderson may not make the 53. but the kid has talent, regardless of lack of pedigree. i'm not saying bruce anderson will achieve the ranks of priest holmes and arian foster (or breida?), but all were UDFA, as was phillip lindsay (who won the job away from #71 pick overall royce freeman). pedigree might be more important when a coach has something to prove, but arians did not target incumbent ronald jones. and the "no way will a round 7 sophomore start over pick #27 rashaad penny" discourse is further evidence that talent surfaces. arians did target bruce anderson in free agency, however. and he targeted andre ellington when he became the cardinals' head coach in 2013... and now again when as bucs' head coach six years later.

when ronald jones was "on" in college, he showed some explosiveness. when ro-jo was on the field as a pro, he seemed tepid; to me, ronald jones has failed to show NFL-level vision. maybe through solid coaching he can grow regarding vision. look at how ro-jo ignores the giant-sized hole up the middle and instead runs into traffic:

giphy.gif

could be a 54-yard TD run for a better RB

 

bruce arians might argue that in his claiming of andre ellington in free agency, he has signed "one of the decent FA RBs." he also might say the same thing of his acquisition of bruce anderson.

the bucs spent 6 of their 8 draft picks on defense because their defense was among the worst in the league. landing bunting, dean, and edwards for the secondary was excellent drafting. offloading kwon alexander (who only played 18 games in the last two seasons) and picking up an even better (IMO) LSU linebacker in devin white was brilliant. drafting an RB when several talented remain undrafted (ozigbo, james williams, and bruce anderson) also seems like a good move from the front office.

all i'm suggesting is that the "is it barber or jones?" question or even "when will ro-jo take over?" question is myopic.

 

Its a 2 man backfield barring injury.   My opinion of course-  but nothing of note so far has transpired to make me think otherwise.   All rainbows and kisses from Arians for Barber/RJ.   They needed depth-  so Anderson makes as much sense as any other later rb flyer.   

Name dropping and posting film from Rojos rookie season is....disingenuous to say the least.  It’s well known Rojo was an absentee rookie-  but that’s not his potential.     

Let’s move on.  Every team has a Bruce Anderson waiting for his practice squad assignment.  

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51 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

 

Its a 2 man backfield barring injury.   My opinion of course-  but nothing of note so far has transpired to make me think otherwise.   All rainbows and kisses from Arians for Barber/RJ.   They needed depth-  so Anderson makes as much sense as any other later rb flyer.   

Name dropping and posting film from Rojos rookie season is....disingenuous to say the least.  It’s well known Rojo was an absentee rookie-  but that’s not his potential.     

Let’s move on.  Every team has a Bruce Anderson waiting for his practice squad assignment.  

 

i respect your post and your opinion, but disagree on the player and philosophically. every team has RBs destined for practice squads, yes; every team has RBs due to be cut, yes. which is why dynasty and devy-league owners need to be particularly thorough in weeding the pro and college turf.

 

maybe we’re just seeing this from two different perspectives. your response tells me that you don’t play in dynasty leagues often. if i am incorrect here, say the word, but i imagine your energies focus predominantly on redraft. securing the boom UDFA before week 1 provides more than just a leg-up on leaguemates. phillip lindsay is the best and most recent example. in redraft, the “nobody saw it coming” statement is common. building a dynasty team requires more energy. this year, i like ozigbo, especially if latavius murray falters in some way. i also like james williams and bruce anderson. i like the landing spot for holyfield (don’t see much ahead of him in artis-payne or scarlett) but am not overly impressed by what i’ve seen from him yet. must wait in carolina.

 

for you to call references to RBs “name-dropping” is condescending. i’m the first to admit i’ve made mistakes and will continue to make mistakes—this is fantasy, after all—but the road to excellence is best travelled in a vehicle of eternal vigilance: we dynasty owners watch, study, research, reflect, and learn. my buddy matt berry and i were just discussing this over croissants and chai tea this morning (that is “name dropping”).

 

june’s rainbows and kisses from coaches can help to forecast the weather, but preseason will tell much. a great example of this was gus edwards: his aggressiveness was clear last august, even if his talent seemed only north-south. he was snatched in every one of my dynasty leagues before september kickoff. in redraft, gus wasn’t taken until mid-november, after putting up 115 yards / 1 TD. gus went completely undrafted in best ball. and he remained a flex from november until season’s end. free agency is open now in all of my dynasty leagues; the goal is to make the right moves before preseason even begins. “moving on” only occurs when / if a player actually gets relegated to the practice squad.

 

regarding the clip of ronald jones being “disingenuous,” consider: a large part of rotoworld posts include posturing, misinformed opinion, and homers dreaming blindly. when someone provides textual / visual evidence clearly supporting a statement (i.e. the lack of ro jo's vision), i’d suggest it at least be taken into consideration instead of dismissed. would be great to see more evidence in RW forums. all that said, i’m in the odd situation of seemingly trolling ronald jones: i actually do believe in his potential, but again i am not in the camp of “when will rojo take over barber’s job?” there is more in the bucs’ backfield to consider.

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30 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

i respect your post and your opinion, but disagree on the player and philosophically. every team has RBs destined for practice squads, yes; every team has RBs due to be cut, yes. which is why dynasty and devy-league owners need to be particularly thorough in weeding the pro and college turf.

 

 

 

maybe we’re just seeing this from two different perspectives. your response tells me that you don’t play in dynasty leagues often. if i am incorrect here, say the word, but i imagine your energies focus predominantly on redraft. securing the boom UDFA before week 1 provides more than just a leg-up on leaguemates. phillip lindsay is the best and most recent example. in redraft, the “nobody saw it coming” statement is common. building a dynasty team requires more energy. this year, i like ozigbo, especially if latavius murray falters in some way. i also like james williams and bruce anderson. i like the landing spot for holyfield (don’t see much ahead of him in artis-payne or scarlett) but am not overly impressed by what i’ve seen from him yet. must wait in carolina.

 

 

 

for you to call references to RBs “name-dropping” is condescending. i’m the first to admit i’ve made mistakes and will continue to make mistakes—this is fantasy, after all—but the road to excellence is best travelled in a vehicle of eternal vigilance: we dynasty owners watch, study, research, reflect, and learn. my buddy matt berry and i were just discussing this over croissants and chai tea this morning (that is “name dropping”).

 

 

 

june’s rainbows and kisses from coaches can help to forecast the weather, but preseason will tell much. a great example of this was gus edwards: his aggressiveness was clear last august, even if his talent seemed only north-south. he was snatched in every one of my dynasty leagues before september kickoff. in redraft, gus wasn’t taken until mid-november, after putting up 115 yards / 1 TD. gus went completely undrafted in best ball. and he remained a flex from november until season’s end. free agency is open now in all of my dynasty leagues; the goal is to make the right moves before preseason even begins. “moving on” only occurs when / if a player actually gets relegated to the practice squad.

regarding the clip of ronald jones being “disingenuous,” consider: a large part of rotoworld posts include posturing, misinformed opinion, and homers dreaming blindly. when someone provides textual / visual evidence clearly supporting a statement (i.e. the lack of ro jo's vision), i’d suggest it at least be taken into consideration instead of dismissed. would be great to see more evidence in RW forums. all that said, i’m in the odd situation of seemingly trolling ronald jones: i actually do believe in his potential, but again i am not in the camp of “when will rojo take over barber’s job?” there is more in the bucs’ backfield to consider.

 

Visual evidence?    Nah bro-  that’s cherrypicking.   You can’t possibly form a proper opinion of Jones off of one run from last season.   

Also, Naming a few success stories out of HUNDREDS of UDFAs who get a look is also disingenuous.  Or you merely lack statistical insight.   Last season there were over 400 UDFAs to get an NFL offer of some kind.   It’s the longest of odds to make a roster...and to actually become a rotation player is even longer.   

 

I play in 2 devy dynasties and one standard dynasty- since you wanted to know.    Anderson and Ellington are rostered in the devies.   $0 FAAB flyers.   Because....you never know.   That’s where you’re accurate.     

 

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I find it odd that we give Ronald Jones a pass on 2018 because of o-line woes and things of that nature, but on the flip side we use Peyton Barber's play as an argument against him?

 

Yes it's true, Peyton Barber is no superstar, but we've seen nothing from Jones to think any differently about him.  This isn't even the coaching staff that drafted Ronald Jones, and that coaching staff didn't even like him enough to give him a late season tryout.

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4 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

I find it odd that we give Ronald Jones a pass on 2018 because of o-line woes and things of that nature, but on the flip side we use Peyton Barber's play as an argument against him?

 

Yes it's true, Peyton Barber is no superstar, but we've seen nothing from Jones to think any differently about him.  This isn't even the coaching staff that drafted Ronald Jones, and that coaching staff didn't even like him enough to give him a late season tryout.

 

Such is the nature of being an early second round pick.    You’re nuts to give up on a guy of that pedigree after one disappointing season.   He was also one of the youngest players drafted last year.    Patience and opportunity is warranted as long as his attitude and work ethic is on point.   Which- so far it is.    

 

I don’t know if he cuts the mustard or not....but I’m pretty sure he gets a legit chance to earn a big role.   

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32 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

 

Such is the nature of being an early second round pick.    You’re nuts to give up on a guy of that pedigree after one disappointing season.   He was also one of the youngest players drafted last year.    Patience and opportunity is warranted as long as his attitude and work ethic is on point.   Which- so far it is.    

 

I don’t know if he cuts the mustard or not....but I’m pretty sure he gets a legit chance to earn a big role.   

I could understand that if this was the staff that drafted him, but it's not.  I also think we see more of a split in the backfield than last year(especially if Jones starts) because Arians will want to get some pass catching backs on the field.

 

I do however think he was extremely overrated as a prospect and just isn't a very good player.

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1 minute ago, RMJ_12 said:

I could understand that if this was the staff that drafted him, but it's not.  I also think we see more of a split in the backfield than last year(especially if Jones starts) because Arians will want to get some pass catching backs on the field.

 

Its not like Jones was some wild swing.   He was projected 2nd/3rd.  Immense potential, but raw and young.  

I could see him and Barber splitting pretty evenly.   Rojo run bias and Barber pass.    It’s a tough pill to swallow until we get more clarity 

 

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24 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

Its not like Jones was some wild swing.   He was projected 2nd/3rd.  Immense potential, but raw and young.

I think that's just where I disagree with most.  He has draft capital, but I never saw immense potential whatsoever.

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44 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

I think that's just where I disagree with most.  He has draft capital, but I never saw immense potential whatsoever.

 

A lot of NFL scouts and prospect evaluators saw something hence his high-ish draft grade when he was coming out

 

no offense but trust their eyes over yours haha obv dont know your background in evaluating prospects but if the consensus around NFL was 2nd-3rd round grades there was/is def something there ya know

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28 minutes ago, kmoore1521 said:
1 hour ago, RMJ_12 said:

I think that's just where I disagree with most.  He has draft capital, but I never saw immense potential whatsoever.

A lot of NFL scouts and prospect evaluators saw something hence his high-ish draft grade when he was coming out

 

no offense but trust their eyes over yours haha obv dont know your background in evaluating prospects but if the consensus around NFL was 2nd-3rd round grades there was/is def something there ya know

 

and we all know that RB scouts are never wrong...

except when they are wrong...

bears taking cedric benson at 1.04, trent richardson going at 1.03, or my beloved jets taking their franchise RB at 1.02 (blair thomas).

and those busts are just top 5 picks. don't have time to consider busted RB draft selections in rounds 2 and 3.

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Just now, Sack Exchange said:

 

and we all know that RB scouts are never wrong...

except when they are wrong...

bears taking cedric benson at 1.04, trent richardson going at 1.03, or my beloved jets taking their franchise RB at 1.02 (blair thomas).

 

and those busts are just top 5 picks. don't have time to consider busted RB draft selections in rounds 2 and 3.

 

That wasnt the argument anyway, they were talking if he has upside/immense potential which he does or else he wouldnt have gotten the grades he did, this isnt a can he a bust discussion homie 

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1 hour ago, kmoore1521 said:

That wasnt the argument anyway, they were talking if he has upside/immense potential which he does or else he wouldnt have gotten the grades he did, this isnt a can he a bust discussion homie 

I don't even really understand what this means, grades can be wrong.  That what a bust is in professional sports.  When a player busts it usually mean that they didn't have the potential that teams thought they did.  Others are just busts off the field.

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On 6/19/2019 at 3:40 PM, wideopen21 said:

"True, but there are also some really nice gifs of Ronald Jones running all over real college defenses, not Sam Houston/Delaware etc.."

 

You can get an FCS guy who can play, but his profile has to say he's capable of becoming something other than a jag. You want to read your player was a 4-star recruit and in a top program, but didn't want to sit in a crowded backfield. Or, he got caught smoking pot, something. Not that, given his skill set, he belonged at East Jesus St. Your player has to dominate that level of competition & from the material I have, he didn't do that.    

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16 hours ago, kmoore1521 said:

 

That wasnt the argument anyway, they were talking if he has upside/immense potential which he does or else he wouldnt have gotten the grades he did, this isnt a can he a bust discussion homie 

 

not sure what your post's point is, though i'm sure you intended to deepen the discussion.

from where i sit, last year ronald jones was placed into an RB tier with nick chubb and kerryon johnson (and was drafted by the bucs in between these two RBs). but imo, no way does he rank alongside chubb and kerryon, both talented enough to be RB1s in seasons to come. and both showed flashes of this RB1 talent during their rookie years.

perhaps drafting ronald jones at 38th overall was a mistake, perhaps a bust, and certainly this year will tell. but one thing is clear: talented running backs don't need excuses, don't need people do defend what went wrong, what could have happened IF. talent emerges.

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15 hours ago, RMJ_12 said:

I don't even really understand what this means, grades can be wrong.  That what a bust is in professional sports.  When a player busts it usually mean that they didn't have the potential that teams thought they did.  Others are just busts off the field.

 

18 hours ago, RMJ_12 said:

I think that's just where I disagree with most.  He has draft capital, but I never saw immense potential whatsoever.

 

Are we switching to a bust discussion or? i was merely saying he def has potential as many NFL scouts gave him high grades around the league and other evaluators as well for a reason, even if you do not see it, many more qualified (i assume haha) do see it was all i was sayin 

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46 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

not sure what your post's point is, though i'm sure you intended to deepen the discussion.

from where i sit, last year ronald jones was placed into an RB tier with nick chubb and kerryon johnson (and was drafted by the bucs in between these two RBs). but imo, no way does he rank alongside chubb and kerryon, both talented enough to be RB1s in seasons to come. and both showed flashes of this RB1 talent during their rookie years.

perhaps drafting ronald jones at 38th overall was a mistake, perhaps a bust, and certainly this year will tell. but one thing is clear: talented running backs don't need excuses, don't need people do defend what went wrong, what could have happened IF. talent emerges.

 

Todd Gurley sophomore season

 

and yea my other point was just in response to the other guy about how he doesnt see much upside or potential, which i thought was a little short sighted after one season because scouts gave him a high grade for a reason, he does have skills and upside if it breaks right, if its late enough i will 100% be taking a risk with him on Arians offense hah complete dice roll tho

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6 minutes ago, kmoore1521 said:

 

Todd Gurley sophomore season

 

i think you've just proven my point that talent emerges: even in a year with a depleted offensive line, poor coaching, and an unbalanced offense, gurley's talent still put up over 1200 yards / 43 receptions / 6 TDs.

a slump from his otherwise otherworldly RB1 production, but RB2 production nonetheless, because talent has a way of manifesting.

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3 minutes ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

i think you've just proven my point that talent emerges: even in a year with a depleted offensive line, poor coaching, and an unbalanced offense, gurley's talent still put up over 1200 yards / 43 receptions / 6 TDs.

a slump from his otherwise otherworldly RB1 production, but RB2 production nonetheless, because talent has a way of manifesting.

 

He avg 3.2 YPC, as a top Draft pick he was guaranteed heavy usage, not out the question that Rojo could put up 3.2 YPC if given 278 carries (hed break down at that usage so not that many carries but you get the point) as well but he was a 2nd rounder so wasnt given the keys even if he sucked like gurley was given, and he only got 24 carries in a SSS last season so cant really even judge much off that, but again hes a complete dart throw but there is room for reward if you invest at the right price

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