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2020 MLB Sign Stealing Discussion


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Man, im hating the Astros even more right now.

So, Beltran shows up to Houston and claims the system they were using to decode signs is behind the times. Ok, cool. No problem.

Now, these players are putting quotes (without allowing their name to be attached to it) claiming they felt like they were hostages, and given Beltran/Coras clout in the big leagues, felt intimidated to approach either and let it be known they were against it. Brian Mccann, big name, experienced, and frankly.. a big boy.. was intimidated by Beltran and refused to rid the Stros of this system after being denied initially?

This just looks to me the Astros players are now throwing Beltran under the pass, and are trying to play the victims.

I hope they all end the year on the IL.

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It amazes me the Astros never traded for Brett Gardner... Dude was a perfect fit for their system.

There is, here you go:  

Astros need to stop and apologizing and just turn full heel. This should be their new coaching staff... Head Coach: Carlos Beltran Hitting Coach: Pete Rose Pitching Coach: Roger Clemens

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Will any of these players throw away their rings?  Not likely.  They knew what they were doing and are only sorry they got caught.  Watch how the whistleblower is "dealt with" compared to the Astros players.  I have zero doubt Fiers is more hated by other players than the cheaters are.  They were all complicit but rationalized it away in their minds.  It's not unique to baseball players. 

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MLB will never allow this to go before a judge or jury.

No way can MLB have players testifying about this. If they tell the truth, MLB has a mess.

If they lie, and then found later proved they did, then possible jail time for perjury.

Civil cases has less burden of proof.

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I would agree, MLB will not let this get to a judge/jury. The unfortunate truth is, this probably goes beyond the Astros, and it just so happens the Stros and Sox were caught.. 
 

As someone else mentioned, as much as i hope it isnt true.. i think the Yankees could be brought into this mess the longer it carries on. Beltran and his time with the Yankees, along with the numbers put up, it all just kind of makes sense.

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On 2/11/2020 at 8:19 PM, Junkie Cosmonaut said:

So exactly how did Carlos Beltran know that the Astros sign stealing methods were "behind the times"?

 

Beltran's 2016

w NYY - .304/.344/.546

w TEX - .280/.325/.451

 

Can't help but think that when this is all said and done, the Yankees are going to get buried in this too. 

 

You're missing the fact that the Yankees were already punished in 2017 for improper use of the bullpen phone in 2016.  So yea they were doing stuff back then in a much smaller, less elaborate way  Once they were punished then they stopped.  Red Sox had the Apple Watch scandal which was a more elaborate scheme. They were still cheating especially once Cora came over.  And I'm still waiting for their punishment.

Nothings going to happen to the Yankees. They were a better team hitting on the road and were blessed to have the Red Sox, O's, and Blue Jays pitching in their division.

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4 hours ago, MrBrown said:

You're missing the fact that the Yankees were already punished in 2017 for improper use of the bullpen phone in 2016.  So yea they were doing stuff back then in a much smaller, less elaborate way  Once they were punished then they stopped.  Red Sox had the Apple Watch scandal which was a more elaborate scheme. They were still cheating especially once Cora came over.  And I'm still waiting for their punishment.

Nothings going to happen to the Yankees. They were a better team hitting on the road and were blessed to have the Red Sox, O's, and Blue Jays pitching in their division.

Red Sox got the idea of the Apple Watch thing from finding out the Yankees had been using them.

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4 hours ago, MrBrown said:

You're missing the fact that the Yankees were already punished in 2017 for improper use of the bullpen phone in 2016.  So yea they were doing stuff back then in a much smaller, less elaborate way  Once they were punished then they stopped.  Red Sox had the Apple Watch scandal which was a more elaborate scheme. They were still cheating especially once Cora came over.  And I'm still waiting for their punishment.

Nothings going to happen to the Yankees. They were a better team hitting on the road and were blessed to have the Red Sox, O's, and Blue Jays pitching in their division.

 

There's no reason to think that Beltran didn't bring it back with him. :alexcorawink: 

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Seen this yesterday 

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/nationals/report-nationals-were-tipped-about-astros-cheating-dodgers-cora

On Tuesday, the Washington Post reporteda new wrinkle to the entire situation: The Nationals were directly informed by outside sources about the Astros' cheating tendencies and were prepared for them prior to the 2019 World Series.

According to the report, Houston's sign-stealing tactic was well known throughout baseball.

The whole industry knows they’ve been cheating their a---- off for three or four years," an anonymous executive from a team that faced Houston in the playoffs told the Washington Post. "Everybody knew it."

Nationals second baseman Brian Dozier also played a significant part in Washington's decoding of Houston's tactics. Dozier was a member of the Los Angeles Dodgers in 2017, the same squad that fell to Houston in the 2017 World Series.

Several members of the Dodgers reached out to Dozier ahead of the 2019 World Series to warn him about Houston's sign-stealing tendencies, according to the report.

After gathering all the information from many sources, Washington came up with its own complex sign system. Pitchers had five different sign rotations, according to the Post report, and the Nationals catchers each wore a wristband on their arm to remember, similar to a quarterback wearing a wristband with the plays on it.

 

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Astros need to stop and apologizing and just turn full heel. This should be their new coaching staff...

Head Coach: Carlos Beltran

Hitting Coach: Pete Rose

Pitching Coach: Roger Clemens

Strength and Conditioning Coach: Barry Bonds

Media Production: New England Patriots TV show crew

 

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"I am really sorry about the choices that were made by my team, by the organization and by me.”

Is it me, or am I reading this as Bergman throwing the entire organization, top to bottom, under the bus and driving it back over them?

Funny how he, personally, apologizes last.🙄

 

 

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I hope all Houston players on that 2017 team are treated by Hall of Fame voters the way the steroid cheats are treated now. 

I'd like to ask the players that if it didn't help them at all why did they do it?  Crane wants to keep that banner come hell or high water - and ridiculously claims that the cheating had zero outcome.  If it had zero outcome why do it?  They players thought it gave them an edge, and that edge was cheating.

I want even one player to show some real contrition and give back his WS ring. 

Verlander is a total hypocrite.  Forever.  Outspoken against other forms of cheating, but then knowingly goes along with it when it benefits him.

Altuve absolutely was wearing a buzzer - no other way to explain that at bat against Chapman and how he was so worried about his shirt getting ripped rounding third base and how he sprinted into the lockeroom during the on-field celebration to change. To claim he's modest and his wife gets mad at him is silly because they have shirts under jerseys, not to mention he posts beefcake pics on his instagram.

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1 hour ago, charger_ss24 said:

In other words, they are sorry, they feel awfully bad and promise to be better.

But they will keep that title come hell or high water!

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28692978/astros-alex-bregman-jose-altuve-apologize-actions-2017

 

1 hour ago, Sidearmer said:

The apology today was pathetic. They hired a PR company to deal with this and have continued to handle it the worst possible way somehow.

 

1 hour ago, Fuzzy_Slippers said:

Horrendous apologies. The Astros had time to prepare and they floundered. They all looked liked fools. 

You noticed they only apologized for the year 2017. 

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30 minutes ago, shakestreet said:

Do you still think the Houston Astros did nothing wrong?

I think the majority of teams -- and I mean almost ALL of them -- do this with any and all technology of their era so I find it hypocritical just to dump on the Astros. 

Again, if you actually want to end sign stealing via technology then FIX the problem by using technology to send the signs to the pitcher instead and going on with this stupid, fake self-righteous rants about it when some team gets caught.  Then what?  You just turn and go off privately to curl up into fetal position and whimper worried about when the next team will get caught instead of going about fixing the problem, MLB.  Because another warning memo won't end it.

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I am 100% in agreement that the solution is to use technology to make it harder to steal signs, but the fact that MLB was slow to address this and didn't do enough to stop it does not change that the teams were specifically told that using tech to steal them was a violation of league rules, yet some teams were caught doing just that.  "Any and all technology of their era" sounds like a bit of a dodge when investigations have failed to find any evidence for other teams during this era.  If such evidence exists, it strains credulity to think that it wouldn't have leaked out given how motivated the teams who got caught would be to demonstrate that they were just keeping up with other cheaters.

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