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Deshaun Watson 2020 Outlook


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Just now, theSPANKER said:

Maybe events occurred afterwards that finally broke the camel's back?

ok cool, then that is his prerogative to get out from under it. slavery and all that other bullshit has nothing to do with it

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Please stop behaving like a 16yo, even if you are. This is a forum mostly populated by adults, so let's have an adult discussion. Points are not "won" by posting a link. Maybe you have a point, m

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Just now, lolcopter said:

ok cool, then that is his prerogative to get out from under it. slavery and all that other bullshit has nothing to do with it

I didn't make the "we can't have the inmates running the prison comment" after NFL players started kneeling against police brutality and inequality. 

The owner of the team did. 

 

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Just now, theSPANKER said:

I didn't make the "we can't have the inmates running the prison comment" after NFL players started kneeling against police brutality and inequality. 

The owner of the team did. 

 

you are implying that is has an effect on Watson now wanting out of the team, which is a stretch at best

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Just now, lolcopter said:

you are implying that is has an effect on Watson now wanting out of the team, which is a stretch at best

I'm now going to give you another fact, that's on record--after McNair made his statement, DeAndre Hopkins replied the comment hurt him so deeply he said it made him feel "like a slave."

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1 minute ago, theSPANKER said:

I'm now going to give you another fact, that's on record--after McNair made his statement, DeAndre Hopkins replied the comment hurt him so deeply he said it made him feel "like a slave."

again, if Watson is so deeply hurt by this incident that happened three years ago (back when Goff and Wentz were good QBs), then maybe, just maybe, he wouldn't have re-upped his deal 5 months ago

that front office is a train wreck, and he has every right to get out of there, but this goes way beyond implications of racism

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Just now, lolcopter said:

again, if Watson is so deeply hurt by this incident that happened three years ago (back when Goff and Wentz were good QBs), then maybe, just maybe, he wouldn't have re-upped his deal 5 months ago

that front office is a train wreck, and he has every right to get out of there, but this goes way beyond implications of racism

And you know this with certainty without a doubt it had no bearing on his decision wanting out being made now?  I need for you to be my personal futurist psychologist on the effects of social justice issues please. 

 

 

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He knew everything he needed to know about the organization when he signed that extension in September, and signed on the dotted line anyway. No one forced him to sign it. The difference now? A 4-12 season with no improvement in sight. Plain and simple. 

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1 hour ago, jnormy said:

He knew everything he needed to know about the organization when he signed that extension in September, and signed on the dotted line anyway. No one forced him to sign it. The difference now? A 4-12 season with no improvement in sight. Plain and simple. 

 

Very True.  He did know when he signed the dotted line. I'm not disputing that as a fact.

My point is that the organization has a history of racism and it could have played a role into his decision making process of finally wanting out and saying he'll never play for them again. 

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47 minutes ago, theSPANKER said:

 

Very True.  He did know when he signed the dotted line. I'm not disputing that as a fact.

My point is that the organization has a history of racism and it could have played a role into his decision making process of finally wanting out and saying he'll never play for them again. 

And my point is, since it didn’t play a role in his making a recent long-term contractual commitment to the team when he was fully aware of that history, I have serious doubts it would have played a role at all now if the Texans were coming off another successful season.
 

I could be wrong, but I’m just not buying it when he ignored the history to sign a big contract after a 10-win season and now wants so desperately to leave after a 4-win season. Wins and losses are clearly what matter most here to Watson, and that’s to be expected for a competitor like him.

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At the time Watson signed his new contract, the owner who made the comment about inmates running the prison had died, a real NFL head coach named Bill O'Brien was the coach of the team, and the organization had publicly stated that they were going to conduct a search and hire a real GM.  Then the new owner told Watson that the new owner would value Watson's input in the GM search.

Now the situation has been totally flipped.  Watson's coach was fired and replaced by an extremely underwhelming career position coach. The search firm's recommendations on a new GM were circumvented so Easterby could hire his buddy and thus keep his own job.  The team did not bother to interview Watson's recommended choices, and Watson found out about the whole thing through social media.

Watson has lost faith in the future direction of this team and no longer wants to be part of it.  And that is his choice.  No racism would be needed to explain his position, and Watson has not said that is the reason.  To the extent racism is an unspoken factor is difficult to know, but it would hardly be surprising if it were.

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Not to extend the conversation on this point, but I think both of you could genuinely be correct. The history under Bob McNair has been covered and perhaps under Cal, promises were made to him that made him feel comfortable signing that extension.

It's clear that promises were made regarding his input on the organization that were then broken. That could have easily been the straw that broke the camel's back, where he now feels like any promises made to him that got him comfortable signing that extension were false promises and he just wants out. 

This nugget from Peter King tells you that he clearly isn't alone in his thinking: "It’s gotten to the point where, I’m told, even some respected veterans on the teams have, in effect, told Watson, Go ahead. Go. We love you. We don’t want you to get trapped here. You don’t owe us anything."

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5 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

At the time Watson signed his new contract, the owner who made the comment about inmates running the prison had died, a real NFL head coach named Bill O'Brien was the coach of the team, and the organization had publicly stated that they were going to conduct a search and hire a real GM.  Then the new owner told Watson that the new owner would value Watson's input in the GM search.

Now the situation has been totally flipped.  Watson's coach was fired and replaced by an extremely underwhelming career position coach. The search firm's recommendations on a new GM were circumvented so Easterby could hire his buddy and thus keep his own job.  The team did not bother to interview Watson's recommended choices, and Watson found out about the whole thing through social media.

Watson has lost faith in the future direction of this team and no longer wants to be part of it.  And that is his choice.  No racism would be needed to explain his position, and Watson has not said that is the reason.  To the extent racism is an unspoken factor is difficult to know, but it would hardly be surprising if it were.

 

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6 hours ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:

Trade him to Miami, they got Tua and #3 that’s the equivalent of 2 1sts add #18 and a 2022 1st and that’s 4 1st rounders for Watson. 

Pretty sure Miami likes Tua and they plan to stick with him.  I am not sure I agree with them.  But it seems to me they will give Tua one more full season, minimum.

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On 2/2/2021 at 8:36 AM, trilly said:

Not to extend the conversation on this point, but I think both of you could genuinely be correct. The history under Bob McNair has been covered and perhaps under Cal, promises were made to him that made him feel comfortable signing that extension.

It's clear that promises were made regarding his input on the organization that were then broken. That could have easily been the straw that broke the camel's back, where he now feels like any promises made to him that got him comfortable signing that extension were false promises and he just wants out. 

This nugget from Peter King tells you that he clearly isn't alone in his thinking: "It’s gotten to the point where, I’m told, even some respected veterans on the teams have, in effect, told Watson, Go ahead. Go. We love you. We don’t want you to get trapped here. You don’t owe us anything."

So, the Houston Texans are a Toy Story movie now?

Edited by fachowski
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10 minutes ago, fachowski said:

So, the Houston Texans are a Toy Story movie now?

Well, let's look up some random Toy Story quotes:

“Don’t tell me what to do.”

“This is the perfect time to panic!”

“That wasn’t flying. That was falling with style.”

“From now on you must take good care of your toys, because if you don’t, we’ll find out, Sid. We toys can see everything! So play nice!”

“The word I’m searching for, I can’t say because there’s preschool toys present.”

tenor.gif

I say yes. 

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16 hours ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:

Trade him to Miami, they got Tua and #3 that’s the equivalent of 2 1sts add #18 and a 2022 1st and that’s 4 1st rounders for Watson. 

That's a lot to give up for a qb that you don't get the benefit of a rookie contract from. I wouldn't blame Miami if they stuck to the plan.

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On 1/30/2021 at 12:26 PM, BMcP said:

Speaking of “points,” I’m still not understanding that poster’s overarching point: is it that Watson really isn’t all that good?  Man, I hope not - he’s on a HOF trajectory at the moment.  Is it that he wouldn’t do much to move the needle for any number of competitive teams?  Freelund projected him to be a 5+ WAR contributor to multiple teams should they succeed in acquiring him.  Is it that he isn’t worth the cost?  We don’t even know what the cost is at the moment, because Houston hasn’t responded to any inquiries.

 

Can anyone help a brother out here?

I believe they stated that they had no interest in trading the player. At least that's what their GM said in his presser. I'd imagine if someone offers them what they feel is fair value, they'll deal him. Not sure why they need to rush moving their best asset.

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9 minutes ago, fluffy69 said:

I believe they stated that they had no interest in trading the player. At least that's what their GM said in his presser. I'd imagine if someone offers them what they feel is fair value, they'll deal him. Not sure why they need to rush moving their best asset.

Because the earlier they trade Watson, the more they will get.  Because more teams will be in the bidding.  And the acquiring team will want Watson ASAP so he can start learning a new playbook, developing timing with his WRs, incorporate him into the 2021 marketing campaign, etc.

Once it gets later, teams start making their own moves.  And if it gets down to a situation where only a couple of teams are still bidding, the price might get lower.

Or maybe Houston thinks Watson is bluffing, and that he will humble his pride and report and play for them, in the end.  If that's their play, we won't know Watson's fate until the start of training camp.

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On 2/1/2021 at 4:01 PM, lolcopter said:

And you do?

 

We don't know what role it has in Watson's wanting out. It would be perfectly reasonable to assume that it plays SOME role in Watson's opinion of the Texas front office. That's the point.

You're the only one trying to definitively claim one way or the other without actually knowing.

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32 minutes ago, ThreadKiller said:

 

We don't know what role it has in Watson's wanting out. It would be perfectly reasonable to assume that it plays SOME role in Watson's opinion of the Texas front office. That's the point.

You're the only one trying to definitively claim one way or the other without actually knowing.

I am not claiming that at all. However if accusation of racism are to hold any actual water, it may have to go beyond simply not interviewing a player's choices for head coach. Bob McNair has been dead for over two years. Easterby is obviously in way over his head, and Caserio broke/lost Watson's trust early on. The situation has been a complete debacle, but to claim it is because of RACISM (with no actual proof), is about the biggest oversimplification that could exist.

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We don't know to what extent racism is playing a role.  I agree that no racism whatsoever would be needed to explain Watson's disillusion regarding the Texans path forward.

But if there is racism under the surface within the team, they need to get it under control, and quickly, if they want to remain viable as a factor in the NFL, rather than an afterthought.

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If Deshaun Watson came out tomorrow and said he was being racially discriminated against, I'd be first in line to support him. But as it currently stands, there has been no evidence of that occurring, nor has that been a major factor in his decision making. This is more Jay Cutler than you want to admit. Trust was broken between the front office / GM/ HC and a star player, and the star player wants out. It's as simple as that. To throw baseless accusations of racism into the equation does not serve to help Watson's grievances at all. Hiring Caserio is not racist. Not hiring Bieniemy is not racist. 

If racist tendencies do exist behind the scenes in the Houston front office, I agree it will need to be cleaned up in order for the organization to be viable long term. But that if just an "if" scenario at this current juncture, and until I hear otherwise from Watson or one of his representatives, that does not appear to be a deciding factor.

These accusations should not be thrown around casually, that's all. Where they are indeed baseless, it only serves to undermine legitimate critiques of race relations. You think you're doing Watson favors, but he's a grown a** man who can handle his own. If it is because of racism, I have no doubt he would let it be know loud and clear.

Edited by lolcopter
Bieniemy still could get the HC job fwiw
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