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Phillip Lindsay 2020 Outlook


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I got a bit interested in the Gordon/Lindsay split question so I did what anyone who is trying to answer a question should do: went looking for evidence.  That in a minute, but first let us talk about

Indeed! He's constantly having to prove he's the better RB. He beat Royce and that other garbage his rookie season. It's too bad he got hurt because he's definitely a better RB than Gordon at this poi

Denver seems to be the Detroit of the west when it comes to their RB situation.  They bury their best guys and then try to force the guys they "want" to do well even when they suck.  Remember when CJ

24 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

And why do you think that 

 

I'm guessing because he's coming back from an injury and Freeman likely gets some touches also.

 

I'm more worried about the matchup but I guess I have to roll with Lindsay over James White since I expect the Pats to lead most of the game.

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On 10/16/2020 at 12:59 PM, BGDDYKWL said:

All the Gordon stuff is false hope. Any illness outside of COVID isn't keeping a player out, and the DUI likely won't be resolved for months. 

 

17 hours ago, BGDDYKWL said:

Outside of COVID, when was the last time a very relevant starter missed a game due to illness? I just don't see it happening. Unless it's a roundabout way of suspending him. 


This did not age well 👀 

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2 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

This did not age well 👀 

Hey I have Lindsay so I'm glad, but I'll stand by my reasoning and ask the question again. 

When was the last time a very relevant starter missed a game due to your run of the mill illness (non-COVID). It's extremely rare. My suspicion is his DUI factored into this. 

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39 minutes ago, BGDDYKWL said:

Hey I have Lindsay so I'm glad, but I'll stand by my reasoning and ask the question again. 

When was the last time a very relevant starter missed a game due to your run of the mill illness (non-COVID). It's extremely rare. My suspicion is his DUI factored into this. 

 

Certainly possible-  but they’re sticking by the sickness excuse.   I’d bet he’s back next week.   MG a popular player in that clubhouse and Elway is desperate for wins.    The league’s punishment will be deemed sufficient- whenever it comes down.  
 

41 minutes ago, Proteus said:

That tweet and source it came from sounds like a very cautious approach could be in store

 

Doubtful.  He was cleared 2 weeks ago,  they wanted him to get a full weeks practice in- would have been full go last week.   He’s getting 20 touches minimum.    
 

 

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3 hours ago, Impreza178 said:

 

Certainly possible-  but they’re sticking by the sickness excuse.   I’d bet he’s back next week.   MG a popular player in that clubhouse and Elway is desperate for wins.    The league’s punishment will be deemed sufficient- whenever it comes down.  
 

 

Doubtful.  He was cleared 2 weeks ago,  they wanted him to get a full weeks practice in- would have been full go last week.   He’s getting 20 touches minimum.    
 

 

Alright man. I’m sold. Flexing over Swift in ppr and now I have the added bonus of someone to blame if he tanks.

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48 minutes ago, herschel said:

the rodney dangerfield of the league.  all the kid does is get 100 yard games/1000 yard seasons.  think this goes back to being a 1a/1b split between him and gordon.

Probably about a 60/40 split for Gordon because of GL, receiving rep, & money. Lindsay isn’t going away though

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3 minutes ago, BIGFATPANDA said:

I’d say 75/25 Lindsay did do anything special...

Game 1 was the only game they played together. Carry distribution was 15 for Gordon (for 4 quarters), 7 for Lindsay (for 2 quarters). I’d say DEN has a great set-up of 2 similar versatile backs & the offense doesn’t give away what they want to do by the personnel on the field. I’ll stand by my guess & we can agree to disagree 🤷🏻‍♂️

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1 hour ago, KennyWoo said:

I got a bit interested in the Gordon/Lindsay split question so I did what anyone who is trying to answer a question should do: went looking for evidence.  That in a minute, but first let us talk about today's game.

Denver is pretty lousy.  Last season they lost their first 4 and 6 of their first 8, ending their season very early.  They ended up a deceptive 7-9, but five of those wins came against the 5-11 Chargers (twice), 6-10 Browns, 3-12-1 Lions, and 7-9 Raiders in a meaningless Week 17 tilt.  They did beat Houston and Tennessee (who overachieved in the playoffs but were just 9-7).  This season they started 0-3 before being life-and-death to beat Hofstra the Jets. 

Beating the Patriots in Belichick's house is a big deal for them, and they did it largely because of Phillip Lindsay.  Lindsay ran 23 times in a game in which all the other rushing attempts and receptions for Denver totaled 24.  They trusted him.  He came through with a fine 101 yards.

The Pats have been solid against the run this season.  Miami's three backs managed just 69 yards on 22 attempts.  Carson and Hyde went 22 for 94.  Josh Jacobs had 16 for 71; Booker a couple good runs in that game too.  CEH went 16 for 64.  Lindsay's game fits right in with the best of these.

So, what to expect with the Gordon/Lindsay split going forward?  Let's look at the evidence.  Lindsay and Gordon played less than one half of football together.  Lindsay's last involvement in that Week 1 tilt vs. Tennessee came with 4:50 remaining in the 2nd quarter when Lindsay got a goal line carry and took the ball from the 2 to the 1.  That was Lindsay's 7th carry of the game; he also had 1 target (an 11 yard catch).  What was Gordon's involvement up to the point when Phillip Lindsay went off injured?  Five carries, one catch.  In other words, it was basically an even split up to that point.  (Gordon came in after Lindsay was injured and was promptly stuffed on a goal line carry.)

Conclusions?  Well, it was the first game so the coaches may have wanted to use Lindsay a little more than the usual plan to keep his head in the game for the season, etc.  But in the time Lindsay and Gordon were both available, carries were Lindsay 7/5, targets were tied 1/1, and Lindsay got the only goal line carry.  I don't know about snap counts but Gordon ended up 37-19 for the game so it was probably around a 50/50 snap count split when Lindsay was healthy.

It sure felt like in that opener they intended to make this pretty close to a 50/50 or 55/45 type share.  If that continues, Lindsay will be right around 50/50 in workload and will get at least some goal line work.  

Don't expect Lindsay to take a back seat role or drift into the losing end of a 65/35 (or worse) split.  If healthy, he's probably here to stay.  How valuable 50% of the work on a bad offense like this is worth is up to you.


Yeah, as a Broncos fan, I think that’s pretty close to right. Today reminded everyone that Lindsay is still a pretty darn good back when given the opportunity. He wasn’t even targeted today, so could have had an even bigger day. Gordon wasn’t brought in to ride the bench either, but I’d still consider him just the 1A to Lindsay’s 1B (i.e., not a clear-cut #1) and a likely 60/40 split in favor of Gordon when both are healthy.
 

The X-factor is what role will Gordon’s DUI play? 🤔 Fangio said there will be “consequences” although he hasn’t said what that would be (unless you believe the conspiracy theory that Gordon’s “strep throat” was really just a secret suspension, lol). Fangio’s pretty old-school, so who knows if Gordon may have a shorter leash or wind up in the doghouse, especially with Lindsay balling. 
 

As a Broncos fan, I welcomed them bringing in Gordon as I think he’s solid and it’s always good to have more weapons. But I was also surprised - Lindsay isn’t exactly a bum. 🤷🏼‍♂️ Still, I was soooo close to dropping this guy a couple weeks ago after he got injured and it looked like Gordon was going to run away with the job. Soooo glad I stayed the course and could flex him today. Hopefully at least a few of you other guys rolled him out there too and profited today. 👍🏻

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13 hours ago, KennyWoo said:

I got a bit interested in the Gordon/Lindsay split question so I did what anyone who is trying to answer a question should do: went looking for evidence.  That in a minute, but first let us talk about today's game.

Denver is pretty lousy.  Last season they lost their first 4 and 6 of their first 8, ending their season very early.  They ended up a deceptive 7-9, but five of those wins came against the 5-11 Chargers (twice), 6-10 Browns, 3-12-1 Lions, and 7-9 Raiders in a meaningless Week 17 tilt.  They did beat Houston and Tennessee (who overachieved in the playoffs but were just 9-7).  This season they started 0-3 before being life-and-death to beat Hofstra the Jets. 

Beating the Patriots in Belichick's house is a big deal for them, and they did it largely because of Phillip Lindsay.  Lindsay ran 23 times in a game in which all the other rushing attempts and receptions for Denver totaled 24.  They trusted him.  He came through with a fine 101 yards.

The Pats have been solid against the run this season.  Miami's three backs managed just 69 yards on 22 attempts.  Carson and Hyde went 22 for 94.  Josh Jacobs had 16 for 71; Booker a couple good runs in that game too.  CEH went 16 for 64.  Lindsay's game fits right in with the best of these.

So, what to expect with the Gordon/Lindsay split going forward?  Let's look at the evidence.  Lindsay and Gordon played less than one half of football together.  Lindsay's last involvement in that Week 1 tilt vs. Tennessee came with 4:50 remaining in the 2nd quarter when Lindsay got a goal line carry and took the ball from the 2 to the 1.  That was Lindsay's 7th carry of the game; he also had 1 target (an 11 yard catch).  What was Gordon's involvement up to the point when Phillip Lindsay went off injured?  Five carries, one catch.  In other words, it was basically an even split up to that point.  (Gordon came in after Lindsay was injured and was promptly stuffed on a goal line carry.)

Conclusions?  Well, it was the first game so the coaches may have wanted to use Lindsay a little more than the usual plan to keep his head in the game for the season, etc.  But in the time Lindsay and Gordon were both available, carries were Lindsay 7/5, targets were tied 1/1, and Lindsay got the only goal line carry.  I don't know about snap counts but Gordon ended up 37-19 for the game so it was probably around a 50/50 snap count split when Lindsay was healthy.

It sure felt like in that opener they intended to make this pretty close to a 50/50 or 55/45 type share.  If that continues, Lindsay will be right around 50/50 in workload and will get at least some goal line work.  

Don't expect Lindsay to take a back seat role or drift into the losing end of a 65/35 (or worse) split.  If healthy, he's probably here to stay.  How valuable 50% of the work on a bad offense like this is worth is up to you.

Yeah I've been saying in the Gordon thread for awhile that it was a clear 50/50 split in the first half of game 1 and likely will go back to that eventually, hurting Gordon immensely. Gordon did have a bad fumble in that game, and has looked really good while Lindsay has been out so that's working in his favor. Maybe he has earned more than 50% split but I think it'll be an ugly fantasy situation. I own both and ideally want one to sit which has worked fabulously so far this year but that's coming to an end for now.

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