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Clyde Edwards-Helaire 2021 Outlook


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9 hours ago, dontclapGonorrhea said:

Dobbins or Taylor would have been the better back in the Chiefs system. A lot of people tend to overlook at JT23 as a pass catcher. CEH is going to be better, he has had another year and with that oline there is no excuse. 12 or 13 weeks of their schedule is against mediocre run teams. Obviously i know it changes year to year, but that schedule they may get out on top quick and preserve their golden arm. Mahomes has been banged up the last two years and they will protect their future

I don’t necessarily disagree those guys are underrated as pass catchers bc of how they were used as rookies, but that isn’t mutually exclusive to swift being better. I think it’s pretty fair to say Clyde and Swift are better as receivers than JT and dobbins. Swift is also a better runner imo and again, CEH was the rb4 pre draft for most people. It was pretty surprising the Cheifs took him 

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13 hours ago, Stonej14 said:

Johnathon Taylor did less than CEH for 15 weeks with just as much opportunity. If it wasn’t for his week 17 explosion against the 2nd worst defense in the league he would had a worse statistical year than CEH. 

Taylor had 900 and 9 over his final 7 games. Very easy to point to that and say, ok, he clearly got much better as the season progressed and is primed to be an RB1. My point is CEH literally did NOTHING of the sort at any point during the entire season, outside of maybe week 1. So you could actually argue he regressed. 

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44 minutes ago, BGDDYKWL said:

Taylor had 900 and 9 over his final 7 games. Very easy to point to that and say, ok, he clearly got much better as the season progressed and is primed to be an RB1. My point is CEH literally did NOTHING of the sort at any point during the entire season, outside of maybe week 1. So you could actually argue he regressed. 

Taylor did squander his opportunities until he played bad run defenses from Weeks 11-17. His situation was just as good especially since Mack went down Week 1.

The big difference between the two is that JT has a chance to be the centerpiece of his offense will CEH is more of a supporting player.

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Maybe I’m a horrible evaluator of talent but Clyde did not look bad to me AT ALL other than the fact that he’s not quite powerful enough to move a pile on his own.  That chiefs o-line was absolutely horrific at generating any sort of push around the goal line and Clyde doesn’t have that one specific tool in his tool shed to compensate.  They decided they didn’t need to use this failed strategy around the goal line and would just use reeks speed or mahomes arm instead,

The thing is this year they retooled the line I think specifically so they could be more dynamic in those goal line and 3rd/4th and short situations.  Clyde can find a hole if one is there, his vision and lateral agility are elite.  He showed awesome pass catching ability even tho mahomes hated checking down, and he was surprisingly shifty with those spins in the second level. 
 

i think the whole stuff about him not belonging is over wrought.  He’s going to have a good year, a top 12 year I’m guessing, making him a low end RB1.

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9 hours ago, cheezor42 said:

Maybe I’m a horrible evaluator of talent but Clyde did not look bad to me AT ALL other than the fact that he’s not quite powerful enough to move a pile on his own.  That chiefs o-line was absolutely horrific at generating any sort of push around the goal line and Clyde doesn’t have that one specific tool in his tool shed to compensate.  They decided they didn’t need to use this failed strategy around the goal line and would just use reeks speed or mahomes arm instead,

The thing is this year they retooled the line I think specifically so they could be more dynamic in those goal line and 3rd/4th and short situations.  Clyde can find a hole if one is there, his vision and lateral agility are elite.  He showed awesome pass catching ability even tho mahomes hated checking down, and he was surprisingly shifty with those spins in the second level. 
 

i think the whole stuff about him not belonging is over wrought.  He’s going to have a good year, a top 12 year I’m guessing, making him a low end RB1.

Totally agree look at his first game and other highlights he did a good job and is so short it's hard to bring him down, reminded me MJD, unfortunately his adp seems to be creeping up.

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11 hours ago, BGDDYKWL said:

Taylor had 900 and 9 over his final 7 games. Very easy to point to that and say, ok, he clearly got much better as the season progressed and is primed to be an RB1. My point is CEH literally did NOTHING of the sort at any point during the entire season, outside of maybe week 1. So you could actually argue he regressed. 

Well he only had 1123 yards over his first 13 games. Clyde had 1100 in the 13 games he played. In that 13 games the both only 2 games over 100 rushing yards. Clyde had 3 games over 100 yards total and Taylor had 4 games over 100 yards total. Taylor had 8TDs Clyde had 5tds. They were essentially the same player.
 

Taylor did get lucky with that schedule at the end of the year (houston 2x, Jacksonville, and Vegas). but the last game of the year got the 2nd worst defense and ripped off 250 yards and that’s all ppl remember they think he’s Derrick henry 2.0 but for 15 weeks if you owned Taylor you weren’t  thrilled for about 12 of em.

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I don't understand how people can claim CEH "is what he is" after just one, COVID filled rookie season.  Don't forget the history of Andy Reid RBs, and the reason people were so excited for CEH going into last season.  Those narratives pushed his ADP way higher than it should have been, and I think people still have a sour taste watching him get stuffed a number of times Week 1 on national TV against Houston.  

CEH only played 13 games last year and still ranked 15th in carries, 14th in targets, and still finished as the overall RB22 on the season.  Weeks 1-11 before he got hurt he was averaging 13.3 half-PPR points per game, RB16.  He was getting 4.5 targets per game over that time.  

At a more reasonable ADP of RB14 this year I'm all over CEH at that price.  

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44 minutes ago, Fort4242 said:

I don't understand how people can claim CEH "is what he is" after just one, COVID filled rookie season.  Don't forget the history of Andy Reid RBs, and the reason people were so excited for CEH going into last season.  Those narratives pushed his ADP way higher than it should have been, and I think people still have a sour taste watching him get stuffed a number of times Week 1 on national TV against Houston.  

CEH only played 13 games last year and still ranked 15th in carries, 14th in targets, and still finished as the overall RB22 on the season.  Weeks 1-11 before he got hurt he was averaging 13.3 half-PPR points per game, RB16.  He was getting 4.5 targets per game over that time.  

At a more reasonable ADP of RB14 this year I'm all over CEH at that price.  

Getting him at RB14 feels like robbery I agree 

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41 minutes ago, dontclapGonorrhea said:

you should be moist. Unless he gets injured should have a strong second season.

Good stuff here.  Do you write for one of the fantasy websites?

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3 hours ago, Fort4242 said:

I don't understand how people can claim CEH "is what he is" after just one, COVID filled rookie season.  Don't forget the history of Andy Reid RBs, and the reason people were so excited for CEH going into last season.  Those narratives pushed his ADP way higher than it should have been, and I think people still have a sour taste watching him get stuffed a number of times Week 1 on national TV against Houston.  

CEH only played 13 games last year and still ranked 15th in carries, 14th in targets, and still finished as the overall RB22 on the season.  Weeks 1-11 before he got hurt he was averaging 13.3 half-PPR points per game, RB16.  He was getting 4.5 targets per game over that time.  

At a more reasonable ADP of RB14 this year I'm all over CEH at that price.  

RB22 in a weak season isnt something to write home about. Most starting RBs with a good opportunity share should be able to deliver a baseline of X amount of yards and X amount of TDs etc. There wasnt a lot to like last season.

That being said he's one of the bets among round 2 RBs to actually outplay his ADP. Hopefully he doesnt get pulled off the field for Williams as much on 3rd downs or KC doesnt bring in another washed up vet.

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4 minutes ago, timexsocialclub said:

Why? As a former RB, doesn't he love CEH?

He's a bad play caller.  The offseason rumblings give me hope that Andy Reid recognized the offense was stale and he is getting more involved again.

 

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1 minute ago, Nap Time said:

He's a bad play caller.  The offseason rumblings give me hope that Andy Reid recognized the offense was stale and he is getting more involved again.

 

A bit off-topic but I thought he was more a less a cinch to land an HC job this year based on reports throughout the season last year.

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56 minutes ago, timexsocialclub said:

A bit off-topic but I thought he was more a less a cinch to land an HC job this year based on reports throughout the season last year.

Same - thought recall him being hyped up as some 'offensive playcalling wizard'... is he just another right guy right time sitch like half of BB's assistant coaches lol?

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25 minutes ago, Maroney's Bolgna said:

Same - thought recall him being hyped up as some 'offensive playcalling wizard'... is he just another right guy right time sitch like half of BB's assistant coaches lol?

Matt Nagy got his job based on Alex Smith's career year in 2017. Bienemy could be another Nagy, Taylor or Gase. Its pretty easy to seem like a wizard when you have arguably the best QB talent ever with great weapons at your disposal. A guy like Brian Daboll seems more appealing as a HC candidate.

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On 7/29/2021 at 8:47 AM, Stonej14 said:

Well he only had 1123 yards over his first 13 games. Clyde had 1100 in the 13 games he played. In that 13 games the both only 2 games over 100 rushing yards. Clyde had 3 games over 100 yards total and Taylor had 4 games over 100 yards total. Taylor had 8TDs Clyde had 5tds. They were essentially the same player.
 

Taylor did get lucky with that schedule at the end of the year (houston 2x, Jacksonville, and Vegas). but the last game of the year got the 2nd worst defense and ripped off 250 yards and that’s all ppl remember they think he’s Derrick henry 2.0 but for 15 weeks if you owned Taylor you weren’t  thrilled for about 12 of em.

Definitely was not thrilled with Taylor for half the year, but his second have was much better than CEH and his final season numbers were also MUCH better. CEH didn't do anything beyond ordinary, and my bigger concern is he never looked anything beyond ordinary. 

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34 minutes ago, phillyfan461 said:

Andrew Luck ran a faster 40 than CEH.  Just saying...

Which shows you how little that matters.

image.png.2990d2db65660ba2b325ccfd433169fe.png

This is a chart I made in the Najee Harris thread. As you can see, you can still be a pretty good RB with a 4.61 (which CEH had). People focus on the 40 time because it's an easily measurable number but it doesn't really have a lot of predictive value, even for RBs.

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1 hour ago, Boudewijn said:

Which shows you how little that matters.

image.png.2990d2db65660ba2b325ccfd433169fe.png

This is a chart I made in the Najee Harris thread. As you can see, you can still be a pretty good RB with a 4.61 (which CEH had). People focus on the 40 time because it's an easily measurable number but it doesn't really have a lot of predictive value, even for RBs.

I’m confused what this chart is, Looks like an aggregation of cherry picks. Could make another plot with cj2k and jamal Charles etc. Can you be a slow rb and successful? Sure. It helps to be fast though 

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9 hours ago, Boudewijn said:

Which shows you how little that matters.

image.png.2990d2db65660ba2b325ccfd433169fe.png

This is a chart I made in the Najee Harris thread. As you can see, you can still be a pretty good RB with a 4.61 (which CEH had). People focus on the 40 time because it's an easily measurable number but it doesn't really have a lot of predictive value, even for RBs.

Is this just raw 40 time? Speed score is much better stat to go by. FO did a good write up on it and the concerns regarding CEH's low speed score: https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2020/speed-score-2020

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