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2 hours ago, sasnumberonefan said:

Sounds like SF wanted him to get some extra rest to stay fresh. Pitched Thursday & Friday. Has gotten a lot of work 3 weeks into the season. I’m still optimistic that he is the undisputed guy. 

Confirmed.

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Manager Gabe Kapler said he was trying to avoid using Jake McGee on Sunday after he combined for 35 pitches between Thursday and Friday, so it was the submarining Rogers brought in with a two-run lead in the ninth. Rogers gave up three hits and a run but was able to induce a Jazz Chisholm grounder with two runners on to earn his second save of the season.

 

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"Why don't you come over here and say that?!"

I hate closers - I feel like a dog chasing my tail in a circle. 😡

I’ve been watching the Tigers game. Clase was the only one warming up a few days ago when it looked like the Indians might tie or take the lead. Today, Karinchak was the only guy warming up in th

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49 minutes ago, jmcampbe11 said:

Sorry. My last post timed out while I was still editing it. Here is the final version. 

CLOSER RANKINGS 4/26
1) Hader
2) Chapman
3) Hendriks
4) Diaz
5) Iglesias
6) Kimbrel
7) Jansen
8)Pressly
9) Hand
10) Barnes
11) McGee
12) Melancon
13) Clase
14) Castillo
15) Reyes
16) W.Smith
17) Neris
`18) Garcia
19) Trivino
20) Bard
21) Valdez
23) R.Rodriguez
24) Montero
25) Holland
26) Kennedy
27) Sims
28) Rogers
29) Colome
30) Dollis
31) Crichton
32) Soto

BONUS - TOP ADDITIONAL ADDS FOR HOLDS / RATIOS / Ks
1) Karinchak
2) Gallegos
3) Pomeranz
4) Antone
5) Kopech
6) D.Williams
7) Treinen

8)Ty. Rogers
9) Diekman
10) Whitlock

How us Rodriguez so damn low.  No respect 

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24 minutes ago, Denbo32 said:

How us Rodriguez so damn low.  No respect 

Even if you're bullish on him I don't see how you can justify ranking him any higher than 18th. He's just not going to get the opportunities and there's a very good chance he gets trades and assumes more a set up role in a few months. 

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I won't quote your list, but I'd flip Jansen and Iglesias in your rankings, and possibly Kimbrel and Diaz. I feel like Kimbrel is back and belongs back in that top 5. That's nitpicking, but no love for Richard Rodriguez at all? He hasn't given up a run at all and I'd have him where you rank Castillo, despite the likelihood of a trade deadline deal. I'd also definitely put Kennedy a notch above Holland and Yimi Garcia deserves a bump above Hector Neris at least. 

On your bonus list, I love Antone but would bump him down to 9th just on the basis that he won't record saves, although you do list as for ratios, I think every pitcher on that list will have a bit more value with earning 3-8 saves.

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Just now, jmcampbe11 said:

Even if you're bullish on him I don't see how you can justify ranking him any higher than 18th. He's just not going to get the opportunities and there's a very good chance he gets trades and assumes more a set up role in a few months. 

I reject the notion that he won't get the opportunities, perhaps compared to a really top tier closer, sure, but it's not like bad teams aren't going to win their fair share of CLOSE games and there is nothing precluding a closer on a bad team from leading the majors in saves. His trade risk is considerable, I will agree that you could hold him down on that basis. Everyone outside of the top 10 has some flies on them, so I'll give credit to the guy pitching lights out since last season.

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The Pirates have actually been playing well and are a .500 team.  Ironically, the main reason for his lack of saves seems to be too many blowout games for the Pirates side. Sustainable?  Probably not.  The Pirates will be involved in way more close games.

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48 minutes ago, Richard Kimble said:

I reject the notion that he won't get the opportunities, perhaps compared to a really top tier closer, sure, but it's not like bad teams aren't going to win their fair share of CLOSE games and there is nothing precluding a closer on a bad team from leading the majors in saves. His trade risk is considerable, I will agree that you could hold him down on that basis. Everyone outside of the top 10 has some flies on them, so I'll give credit to the guy pitching lights out since last season.

It's long been established that the difference in the number of save chances between closers on good and bad teams is pretty small, so people shouldn't be using that as much of a factor.

Where the team's record I think does legitimately come into the assessment is around the probability he gets traded by July to a team who uses him in a setup role, which is a greater risk for him than many on the list. 

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58 minutes ago, Richard Kimble said:

I reject the notion that he won't get the opportunities, perhaps compared to a really top tier closer, sure, but it's not like bad teams aren't going to win their fair share of CLOSE games and there is nothing precluding a closer on a bad team from leading the majors in saves. His trade risk is considerable, I will agree that you could hold him down on that basis. Everyone outside of the top 10 has some flies on them, so I'll give credit to the guy pitching lights out since last season.

It's fine to say that even bad teams get their saves, but the data (for the Pirates) over the last few seasons doesn't really support that claim. 

2020 - The Pirates ranked 29th out of 29th in total team saves.

2019 - The Pirates ranked 27th out of 29th in total team saves. 

...and you could make a very strong argument that they're fielding an even worse team this season. Their starting pitching in particular is absolutely atrocious. 

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5 minutes ago, jmcampbe11 said:

It's fine to say that even bad teams get their saves, but the data (for the Pirates) over the last few seasons doesn't really support that claim. 

2020 - The Pirates ranked 29th out of 29th in total team saves.

2019 - The Pirates ranked 27th out of 29th in total team saves. 

...and you could make a very strong argument that they're fielding an even worse team this season. Their starting pitching in particular is absolutely atrocious. 

Gotta dig a bit deeper there, look at the team save opportunities, pirates had 55 in 2019 but only converted 31 of the 55.  So your stats are more because their closers sucked and blew nearly half their save opportunities.

Toronto had the least opportunities tha year with just 42, but converted 33 of them.

In the end there is a big difference between 1st and last in opp’s(70s vs 40s) but even the worst teams are getting enough chances to produce a close with 20-30 saves.  So I’ll take Richard Rodriguez where he has the role locked down on a s---y team over anyone else in a situation where they aren’t THE guy.

I will admit the livelihood of Rodriguez getting traded does hurt the argument though

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1 hour ago, TrueToTheBlue said:

What’s the take on the Seattle situation? Montero still the guy right now?

no, graveman is the top dog.

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1 minute ago, TrueToTheBlue said:

You think so? Montero got the most recent opp and converted it. 

Graveman may be the top dog in the bullpen but used as a fireman to take on the highest leverage situations which will only sometimes involve a save opportunity.

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45 minutes ago, AHF said:

Graveman may be the top dog in the bullpen but used as a fireman to take on the highest leverage situations which will only sometimes involve a save opportunity.

This is what I was thinking. If Montero can hold it together I could see it being a situation similar to what Cleveland is doing with their bullpen. 

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Holland gets the 8th for KC up 3-2. Good news for those speculating on Staumont. Two hurdles still to go: Holland doesn’t blow the lead and Matheny actually chooses his best reliever for the 9th.

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12 minutes ago, meh2 said:

Holland gets the 8th for KC up 3-2. Good news for those speculating on Staumont. Two hurdles still to go: Holland doesn’t blow the lead and Matheny actually chooses his best reliever for the 9th.

 

12 minutes ago, swingbatter said:

Holland in during the 8th of a 3-2 KC game.  Gives up a leadoff triple. Barlow pitched the 7th. 

 

Let's go Staumont (he's up in the pen)!

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2 hours ago, Denbo32 said:

Worried about closer situation in July?  By July about 15 names on this list won't be closers.

Precisely why you take a guy like Rodriguez for his performance and worry about something happening down the road. 

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Staumont throws near 100 and he has k/9 under 8 this year. Xfip is over 5? Too early to look at this stuff?

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