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On 4/22/2021 at 5:13 PM, DerrickHenrysCleats said:


 

We Are All Witnesses.

 

 

Not impressive. I see an enormous O-Line providing a wall up front. He never has to play fast. Receivers are creating all kinds of separation.

 

Jared Goff 2.0

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Mac is Cam backwards  💀

No he doesn't, and you don't think so either. Mac is fine and accurate when he has his first read and 4 seconds to read the field. He even gets to his second read occasionally. But he crumbles un

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Oh come on Mac is not Josh Rosen

I swear if Matt Ryan and Philip Rivers were coming out in this class they'd get shat on because they aren't running a 4.4 or hurdling defenders

There are multiple ways to be a good QB in the NFL

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10 minutes ago, mocha4313 said:

Oh come on Mac is not Josh Rosen

I swear if Matt Ryan and Philip Rivers were coming out in this class they'd get shat on because they aren't running a 4.4 or hurdling defenders

There are multiple ways to be a good QB in the NFL

Mac is Jared Goff

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9 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said:

Mac is Jared Goff

Mac is probably quite a bit smarter than Jared Goff.  Goff showed in the Rams Hard Knocks season that he is not exactly the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.  Goff did not know that the sun rose in the East and set in the West.

But Mac is still going to struggle in the NFL.  And if Mac does not go at 3, he's going to sink like a stone.

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12 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said:

His team was the clear huge favorite in every college game he appeared in?

Playing for the best team doesn't explain 77% comp since it is the greatest qb single season % nfl or ncaa. Drew brees is the next closest with 74%

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7 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

Mac is probably quite a bit smarter than Jared Goff.  Goff showed in the Rams Hard Knocks season that he is not exactly the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.  Goff did not know that the sun rose in the East and set in the West.

But Mac is still going to struggle in the NFL.  And if Mac does not go at 3, he's going to sink like a stone.


won’t slide past 10. I bet that.

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“I am a little confused why people would rather have Trey Lance. I get the Justin Fields thing, but if we’re looking at percentage of accurate throws 10+ yards down the field, since 2018 these are the ranks: number one is Joe Burrow at 57%, number two is Justin Fields at 56%, but Mac Jones is right there at 56% as well. So he’s number three. Then you go down the list and Trey Lance is at 154 at 36% accurate...Every time Trey Lance threw the ball it was to a wide open receiver and he wasn’t even accurate with those wide open wide receivers.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ninersnation.com/platform/amp/2021/4/23/22399528/niners-nation-radio-why-mac-jones-wouldnt-be-such-a-bad-pick
 

@PisEdiRin

 

 

 

 

3F151DBB-8D8D-42A8-9C2C-E81B27F9CCDE.jpeg

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1 hour ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:

“I am a little confused why people would rather have Trey Lance. I get the Justin Fields thing, but if we’re looking at percentage of accurate throws 10+ yards down the field, since 2018 these are the ranks: number one is Joe Burrow at 57%, number two is Justin Fields at 56%, but Mac Jones is right there at 56% as well. So he’s number three. Then you go down the list and Trey Lance is at 154 at 36% accurate...Every time Trey Lance threw the ball it was to a wide open receiver and he wasn’t even accurate with those wide open wide receivers.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ninersnation.com/platform/amp/2021/4/23/22399528/niners-nation-radio-why-mac-jones-wouldnt-be-such-a-bad-pick
 

@PisEdiRin

 

 

 

 

3F151DBB-8D8D-42A8-9C2C-E81B27F9CCDE.jpeg

 

 

Once again, you never look at college production when projecting QBs into the NFL. Those numbers are a byproduct of scheme. Trey Lance lined up under center in a run-first offense, and wasn't playing in a volume-passing offense like all those other guys.

 

5 days.

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9 hours ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:

"We Are All Witnesses."

Great video, although I do see the initial play differently than the narrator. This play, Jones gets hammered & the ball ends up with defense. To me, the breakdown up front isn't due to the LG "oversetting" per say. "Bama's trying to sell run action here, It's not just the guard, the entire OL fires left. The right-handed QB pivots left and here comes the ball-carrier he then fakes a handoff to. The problem was that the defenders on the front side of the run action weren't in read/react. No. 13, who the narrator mentions, along with the DE & a blitzing CB all aggressively penetrate inside. Observe the LT, he's not blocking anybody either. Watch him, yeah he brakes before the LG, but notice he's reaching back to get a hand on 13! 

Alabama had six OL & a TE on the field, Georgia was in their base, their personnel looked & aligned like a 3-4 front. For me, what was concerning is that when Jones takes the snap & pivots left to sell run, he's facing well enough toward that blitzing CB, but because he doesn't have a read there, he doesn't see it, anticipates nothing.  As the narrator states, it's just a two rec'r pattern & both appear doubled on the pre-snap. Like on a RPO, Jones should've been reading whether that front side DB was honoring the run action. The x-slot was cut loose, he was the hot read on that play. 

That said, the receiver never breaks off the deep vertical he's running, so there's no post-snap read & adjustment. Even if Jones scraps that wheel around down town $h!+ they had him do, best case scenario, an incomplete pass. Still, it would've said a lot about his understanding & where he is in his development.  

        

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This debate does not end when Mac Jones is selected at no. 3, or no. 4, or no. 10, or no. 27, or in the 2nd round or later.

It ends when Mac Jones puts up a big season and leads an NFL team deep into the playoffs, or is out of the league.  Whichever comes first.  I think it will be the second outcome.

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5 hours ago, SharkSwimmer said:

"This debate does not end when Mac Jones is selected at no. 3, or no. 4, or no. 10, or no. 27, or in the 2nd round or later. It ends when Mac Jones puts up a big season and leads an NFL team deep into the playoffs, or is out of the league.  Whichever comes first. I think it will be the second outcome."

He's a passer, it's not like his coaches looked for ways to hide him. With a clean follow-through & open receivers he delivers. If he ends up with Kyle Shanahan in SF he'll be in a much better situation than Trevor Lawrence or whoever is taken 2nd. I've looked at several bad outcomes & for me, what's important is his command of the offense, which appeared to be lacking. There's meat on the bone that dog don't eat. 

That 2nd source DHC posted, scroll to about 5:20 in, it's a shot from a zoom cam positioned right behind Jones. Enlarge it so you get a good look at those spindly legs of his. You tell me, do you see even a shred of definition in the lower half of those legs? That suggests he doesn't work the lower half at all... he's not even jogging around on a regular basis, this isn't much of an athlete we're talking about.   

If he applies himself & they can run the ball & protect him, he'll do his part. But is he worth 4 high draft picks? I would've just waited and taken a very similar player in Davis Mills. 

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6 hours ago, SharkSwimmer said:

This debate does not end when Mac Jones is selected at no. 3, or no. 4, or no. 10, or no. 27, or in the 2nd round or later.

It ends when Mac Jones puts up a big season and leads an NFL team deep into the playoffs, or is out of the league.  Whichever comes first.  I think it will be the second outcome.


lol

I’ll be here breaking it all down for you along the way.

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I don’t like Mac Jones much and think he’s quite overrated.

That being said, Goff is a terrible comparison. Goff was viewed as a guy that can make all the throws and while he wasn’t viewed as having an elite arm the general consensus was he’s damn good at hitting WRs in all circumstances. With him the concerns were more of TOs, locking into WRs at times, and mechanical issues especially under pressure. In other words, Goff more or less had all the tools to be an NFL QB but it was a question of if he can get it all right. He obviously hasn’t and all the concerns coming out of college have more or less been validated.

The problem with Jones is his ceiling may just be a very good game manager and a top 5 pick is way too damn high. Unlike Goff, Jones really doesn’t have much concerns when it comes to mechanics or intelligence. He makes the right reads, has good accuracy, doesn’t panic in the pocket, good intangibles, etc etc. The problem is he isn’t very mobile, doesn’t have a rocket arm, and isn’t very big. So it’s fairly concerning that he has to be REALLY good in almost every department in order to be a top 10 NFL QB because his athleticism and size combo is lacking by current standards. It’s not saying he can’t be very good, it’s just very hard for me to see him turning into a pro bowl like player. A second or more ideally third round evaluation would be fine but man this top 5 talk seems crazy.

Regardless, I can see how one can make the mistake of comparing him to Goff but they’re not even close as prospects. In fact, they’re almost on opposite spectrums. 

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4 hours ago, Gohawks said:

I don’t like Mac Jones much and think he’s quite overrated.

That being said, Goff is a terrible comparison. Goff was viewed as a guy that can make all the throws and while he wasn’t viewed as having an elite arm the general consensus was he’s damn good at hitting WRs in all circumstances. With him the concerns were more of TOs, locking into WRs at times, and mechanical issues especially under pressure. In other words, Goff more or less had all the tools to be an NFL QB but it was a question of if he can get it all right. He obviously hasn’t and all the concerns coming out of college have more or less been validated.

The problem with Jones is his ceiling may just be a very good game manager and a top 5 pick is way too damn high. Unlike Goff, Jones really doesn’t have much concerns when it comes to mechanics or intelligence. He makes the right reads, has good accuracy, doesn’t panic in the pocket, good intangibles, etc etc. The problem is he isn’t very mobile, doesn’t have a rocket arm, and isn’t very big. So it’s fairly concerning that he has to be REALLY good in almost every department in order to be a top 10 NFL QB because his athleticism and size combo is lacking by current standards. It’s not saying he can’t be very good, it’s just very hard for me to see him turning into a pro bowl like player. A second or more ideally third round evaluation would be fine but man this top 5 talk seems crazy.

Regardless, I can see how one can make the mistake of comparing him to Goff but they’re not even close as prospects. In fact, they’re almost on opposite spectrums. 


these are scouts talking about Aaron Rodgers leading up to his draft night:

 

What NFL scouts told the Journal Sentinel's Bob McGinn before the draft about quarterback Aaron Rodgers:

Marc Ross, Buffalo: "He's a little short. The thing you worry about is those (Jeff) Tedford guys. They don't do anything for a couple years and then they have a good year or two. Who of his quarterbacks has done what they're supposed to do? None of them. Is he just working magic with great college quarterbacks or just manufacturing guys?"

AFC scout: "I like him. He's a very talented guy. A lot of quarterbacks that were system people have not done very well. That puts up a red flag. Not that he is one of them. He could be an exception. But I can't get it out of my craw."

Rich Snead, Tennessee: "I like him. I just don't know if he's maxed out. He's more accurate than (Kyle) Boller but probably not as athletic. He's a better player than Akili Smith. He's more athletic than (Trent) Dilfer was. He's a little more mobile than Joey Harrington. He had to go to a JC because no one would recruit him because they said he was too small. He's been busting his (expletive) his whole life to get to this point. I just don't know how much more he has to give."

NFC scout: "(Alex) Smith is the better athlete."

 

AFC scout: "I think he has some upside although there are some things that are just ordinary about him."

Jerry Angelo, Chicago: "I'd give Rodgers the edge (over Smith) just because he was easier to evaluate. And there's a little more arm. But the edge is negligible."

NFC scout: "I think he has a good chance of being a bust. Just like every other Tedford-coached quarterback. Thing I struggle with him is he gets sacked a lot. He doesn't have great ability to change the release of the football. He's mechanically very rigid. Brett Favre can change his release point and find different windows. There will be more growing pains with Alex Smith but in the end he has a much better chance to be much better."

NFC scout: "The guys that Tedford has had, what have they developed into? They're too well-schooled. So mechanical. So robotic. I don't know if they become good pro players. I think Rodgers is in that same mold."

AFC scout: "I don't like him. He's a clone of Harrington and Boller. They all throw the same way. What have those guys done? Nothing. If you take him in the second round, fine. Heady guy. They do a marvelous job of coaching quarterbacks there. I don't think he's as good as the top quarterbacks coming out last year."

AFC scout: "I don't think he's in the class of the quarterbacks that came out last year. Strong arm. Pretty good athlete. Still has some holes in his game."

Bill Polian, Indianapolis: "I see a guy who has good arm strength. I see some athletic ability. I see a guy who was pretty good with a good team. I see a guy who's in a pretty efficient offense. Am I certain that he's going to come in and lead my team to the Promised Land? I can't say that. I'm not even sure I can say that about Alex Smith."

AFC scout: "He's a system quarterback. 3-, 5-, 7-step guy. Can't create on his own. Panics under pressure. Gets flustered easy. I don't think there's a quarterback in the draft worthy of a first-round pick. I'm dead serious. None of them are worth it."

NFC scout: "He fit right into the Cal system. He probably executed that as well as anybody. He doesn't have as strong an arm as Boller but can make the same reads and play the scheme as well as Boller did.

 

 

 

its draft time so guys games will get picked apart. what ended up making Aaron Rodgers into a Hall of Famer was his drive to be great. Everyone who gets drafted will continue to work on the weaknesses in their game but the internal drive to be great is what drove them towards success.
 

 

also, I’m not sure what you mean when you say Mac wouldn’t be worth a top 5 pick. If he fits Kyle Shanahan’s system and he ends up winning 1 Super Bowl then the pick will have been worth it. 

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4 hours ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:


these are scouts talking about Aaron Rodgers leading up to his draft night:

 

Yeah none of those comparisons make sense. The problem with Jones is his physical limitations and I don't think he has enough to over come them in order to validate a top 5 pick.

Obviously if he leads the 49ers to a ring he would be worth it but I'm saying he won't. He is closer to A.J McCarron than Rodgers.

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8 hours ago, DerrickHenrysCleats said:


these are scouts talking about Aaron Rodgers leading up to his draft night:

 

What NFL scouts told the Journal Sentinel's Bob McGinn before the draft about quarterback Aaron Rodgers:

Marc Ross, Buffalo: "He's a little short. The thing you worry about is those (Jeff) Tedford guys. They don't do anything for a couple years and then they have a good year or two. Who of his quarterbacks has done what they're supposed to do? None of them. Is he just working magic with great college quarterbacks or just manufacturing guys?"

AFC scout: "I like him. He's a very talented guy. A lot of quarterbacks that were system people have not done very well. That puts up a red flag. Not that he is one of them. He could be an exception. But I can't get it out of my craw."

Rich Snead, Tennessee: "I like him. I just don't know if he's maxed out. He's more accurate than (Kyle) Boller but probably not as athletic. He's a better player than Akili Smith. He's more athletic than (Trent) Dilfer was. He's a little more mobile than Joey Harrington. He had to go to a JC because no one would recruit him because they said he was too small. He's been busting his (expletive) his whole life to get to this point. I just don't know how much more he has to give."

NFC scout: "(Alex) Smith is the better athlete."

 

AFC scout: "I think he has some upside although there are some things that are just ordinary about him."

Jerry Angelo, Chicago: "I'd give Rodgers the edge (over Smith) just because he was easier to evaluate. And there's a little more arm. But the edge is negligible."

NFC scout: "I think he has a good chance of being a bust. Just like every other Tedford-coached quarterback. Thing I struggle with him is he gets sacked a lot. He doesn't have great ability to change the release of the football. He's mechanically very rigid. Brett Favre can change his release point and find different windows. There will be more growing pains with Alex Smith but in the end he has a much better chance to be much better."

NFC scout: "The guys that Tedford has had, what have they developed into? They're too well-schooled. So mechanical. So robotic. I don't know if they become good pro players. I think Rodgers is in that same mold."

AFC scout: "I don't like him. He's a clone of Harrington and Boller. They all throw the same way. What have those guys done? Nothing. If you take him in the second round, fine. Heady guy. They do a marvelous job of coaching quarterbacks there. I don't think he's as good as the top quarterbacks coming out last year."

AFC scout: "I don't think he's in the class of the quarterbacks that came out last year. Strong arm. Pretty good athlete. Still has some holes in his game."

Bill Polian, Indianapolis: "I see a guy who has good arm strength. I see some athletic ability. I see a guy who was pretty good with a good team. I see a guy who's in a pretty efficient offense. Am I certain that he's going to come in and lead my team to the Promised Land? I can't say that. I'm not even sure I can say that about Alex Smith."

AFC scout: "He's a system quarterback. 3-, 5-, 7-step guy. Can't create on his own. Panics under pressure. Gets flustered easy. I don't think there's a quarterback in the draft worthy of a first-round pick. I'm dead serious. None of them are worth it."

NFC scout: "He fit right into the Cal system. He probably executed that as well as anybody. He doesn't have as strong an arm as Boller but can make the same reads and play the scheme as well as Boller did.

 

 

 

its draft time so guys games will get picked apart. what ended up making Aaron Rodgers into a Hall of Famer was his drive to be great. Everyone who gets drafted will continue to work on the weaknesses in their game but the internal drive to be great is what drove them towards success.
 

 

also, I’m not sure what you mean when you say Mac wouldn’t be worth a top 5 pick. If he fits Kyle Shanahan’s system and he ends up winning 1 Super Bowl then the pick will have been worth it. 

 

 

You just wasted all your time posting this. The 49ers are taking Lance.

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2 hours ago, Gohawks said:

Yeah none of those comparisons make sense. The problem with Jones is his physical limitations and I don't think he has enough to over come them in order to validate a top 5 pick.

Obviously if he leads the 49ers to a ring he would be worth it but I'm saying he won't. He is closer to A.J McCarron than Rodgers.

 

You're talking to a delusional homer. He will never be rational about Mac Jones.

Mac Jones = Jared Goff

3 days until Trey Lance is officially a 49er, and then we can all laugh at DerrickHenryCleats

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2 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said:

 

You're talking to a delusional homer. He will never be rational about Mac Jones.

Mac Jones = Jared Goff

3 days until Trey Lance is officially a 49er, and then we can all laugh at DerrickHenryCleats


3.5 days.

 

We Are All Witnesses.

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