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Guys, MLB has to address the IL onslaught. It’s been bad for years, but this has gotten out of control and the product is suffering massively. Young, exciting stars are out for long stretches and even whole seasons. 
 

Even beyond the frustration in fantasy baseball, the injuries are really hurting a sport trying to compete with the most-worshiped god that is American football. Without young, exciting players on the field to draw fans and TV viewers, I don’t know how they keep up at all. I’ll still watch baseball regardless, but I know I’m in the extreme minority. 
 

Somehow, MLB has to figure out how to keep guys like Luis Robert, Yelich, Jimenez, Tatis, Dustin May (etc etc etc) on the field for the most part. There are prob tons of ways to do it such as more days off, or heavy investment in R&D for training/injury-prevention in team clubhouses, education on what senseless play might get you injured (looking at you, Jimenez). 
 

Anyone else notice this, agree, or have ideas of what can be done to not have the majority of watchable players out early in the season?

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I don't really agree, these injuries occur every year. It just happened that several big ones fell on the same weekend; if anything, I was pleasantly surprised at the lack of major injury to date thus far in MLB. So set aside the bias of being a fantasy manager, and just looking at it from a fan perspective, I agree it sucks when young guys get hurt. This is why boring old vets are just that, though, they know how to get through the grind. Maybe the do sacrifice a little effort at times, but hopefully the young guns follow their lead. But guys like Robert, Harper, Tatis Jr., play the game hard and they're going to get hurt. The freakish injuries happen randomly, but as for pitchers like May, they represent their own breed of risk.

Managers really should learn the lesson that for years, we've coveted these flame throwing types, but they never stay healthy for long. Best case scenario they have a monster Stephen Strasburg year, and then still at that point everyone is aware they are a major injury risk. So teams have instituted innings limits, arbitrary pitch counts, etc., none of which really make sense other than putting to rest the questions you're asking here. Yet, when a team puts a scrub vet in place of a young star in the lineup, everyone demands answers, and of course the infamous Strasburg shutdown will never be forgotten. So there's not really much to be done that they haven't already implemented. On the other hand, it is weird that just NOW in 2021 they realized it might be good for more baserunners to wear oven mitts, more hitters to wear elbow padding and face guards, so at least they are looking closer at the areas of obvious injury to avoid. But stuff like this weekend is unavoidable.

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20 minutes ago, countseth said:

Guys, MLB has to address the IL onslaught. It’s been bad for years, but this has gotten out of control and the product is suffering massively. Young, exciting stars are out for long stretches and even whole seasons. 
 

Even beyond the frustration in fantasy baseball, the injuries are really hurting a sport trying to compete with the most-worshiped god that is American football. Without young, exciting players on the field to draw fans and TV viewers, I don’t know how they keep up at all. I’ll still watch baseball regardless, but I know I’m in the extreme minority. 
 

Somehow, MLB has to figure out how to keep guys like Luis Robert, Yelich, Jimenez, Tatis, Dustin May (etc etc etc) on the field for the most part. There are prob tons of ways to do it such as more days off, or heavy investment in R&D for training/injury-prevention in team clubhouses, education on what senseless play might get you injured (looking at you, Jimenez). 
 

Anyone else notice this, agree, or have ideas of what can be done to not have the majority of watchable players out early in the season?

The NFL has had the same injury issues as well (Even more so on the concussion front) but theyre such a juggernaut thats its only been a small bump in the road so far. I think it will catch up to them as well as more QB's and high profile players get hurt. (Imagine if Patrick Mahomes misses the entire season).

They cant really add more off days without shortening the schedule (Which I would be all for) but thats money out of the owners pockets. This may also be a product of the shortened season last year? We'll see as the year goes on I guess.

 

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18 minutes ago, RoadApple said:

The NFL has had the same injury issues as well (Even more so on the concussion front) but theyre such a juggernaut thats its only been a small bump in the road so far. I think it will catch up to them as well as more QB's and high profile players get hurt. (Imagine if Patrick Mahomes misses the entire season).

They cant really add more off days without shortening the schedule (Which I would be all for) but thats money out of the owners pockets. This may also be a product of the shortened season last year? We'll see as the year goes on I guess.

 

They had Tom Brady miss an entire year the season following his MVP season, they had Luck retire early, multiple star players retire early, Rodgers had his collarbone broken etc. Yeah if Pat Malhomes missed a year it would suck but the NFL wouldn’t be worried. 
They have top end elite talent injuries every single year and they match on 

MLB is a different animal than NFL. It is way more regionally focused and doesn’t worry too much about building their stars out nationally. I personally feel the issue with viewership is less about injuries and more about how the MLB handles its stars and its product. I also think the old school mentality of baseball that looks down on bat flips, celebrating big plays, etc is not helping either. You arent going to bring in more fans with a product that plays slower, has less personality, and such when compared to other sports 

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Posted (edited)

It's all about velocity. The emphasis on velocity means pitchers have to throw max effort all the time and you get the Dustin May situation regularly.

On the hitting side, velocity makes injuries more likely from HBP situations. It also creates higher exit velocity on well struck balls, meaning more full stretch plays in the infield and outfield, more guys crashing into fences like Eloy, hitters bashing foul balls hard off their kneecaps like Yelich and now Rendon, etc.

I don't see a solution other than front offices starting to realize that the velocity arms race comes with a ton of collateral damage and teaching young pitchers command and control instead of just how to throw gas.

Edited by dele
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People get hurt and go on the disabled list all the time...  The only way to keep that from happening is play the game on a computer/console and turn off injuries...

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2 hours ago, countseth said:

Guys, MLB has to address the IL onslaught. It’s been bad for years, but this has gotten out of control and the product is suffering massively. Young, exciting stars are out for long stretches and even whole seasons. 
 

Even beyond the frustration in fantasy baseball, the injuries are really hurting a sport trying to compete with the most-worshiped god that is American football. Without young, exciting players on the field to draw fans and TV viewers, I don’t know how they keep up at all. I’ll still watch baseball regardless, but I know I’m in the extreme minority. 
 

Somehow, MLB has to figure out how to keep guys like Luis Robert, Yelich, Jimenez, Tatis, Dustin May (etc etc etc) on the field for the most part. There are prob tons of ways to do it such as more days off, or heavy investment in R&D for training/injury-prevention in team clubhouses, education on what senseless play might get you injured (looking at you, Jimenez). 
 

Anyone else notice this, agree, or have ideas of what can be done to not have the majority of watchable players out early in the season?

Ball players get hurt cause they have to much bulk on there bodys and it puts stress on tendons that pop when they do baseball stuff. Need to be flexable when playing baseball and todays ballplayers are not flexable.

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2 hours ago, countseth said:

Guys, MLB has to address the IL onslaught. It’s been bad for years, but this has gotten out of control and the product is suffering massively. Young, exciting stars are out for long stretches and even whole seasons. 
 

Even beyond the frustration in fantasy baseball, the injuries are really hurting a sport trying to compete with the most-worshiped god that is American football. Without young, exciting players on the field to draw fans and TV viewers, I don’t know how they keep up at all. I’ll still watch baseball regardless, but I know I’m in the extreme minority. 
 

Somehow, MLB has to figure out how to keep guys like Luis Robert, Yelich, Jimenez, Tatis, Dustin May (etc etc etc) on the field for the most part. There are prob tons of ways to do it such as more days off, or heavy investment in R&D for training/injury-prevention in team clubhouses, education on what senseless play might get you injured (looking at you, Jimenez). 
 

Anyone else notice this, agree, or have ideas of what can be done to not have the majority of watchable players out early in the season?

I agree.

 

I think if we shifted baseball more towards being a softball type league, it will allow guys to throw softer(pretty hard to get hurt throwing underhand) and reduce stress on their body at the plate and in the field.  We may even be able to see Bartolo Colon make a comeback and log innings in centerfield.  How's that for entertainment?  That would be glorious and great for TV.  We're also going to be able to see an explosion in offense much like the steriod era.  I mean... who doesn't dig the longball?

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4 hours ago, countseth said:

Somehow, MLB has to figure out how to keep guys like Luis Robert, Yelich, Jimenez, Tatis, Dustin May (etc etc etc) on the field for the most part. There are prob tons of ways to do it such as more days off, or heavy investment in R&D for training/injury-prevention in team clubhouses, education on what senseless play might get you injured (looking at you, Jimenez). 
 

Anyone else notice this, agree, or have ideas of what can be done to not have the majority of watchable players out early in the season?

You talk about trying to figure out how to keep star players on the field and then immediately suggest more days off?

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4 hours ago, dele said:

It's all about velocity. The emphasis on velocity means pitchers have to throw max effort all the time and you get the Dustin May situation regularly.

On the hitting side, velocity makes injuries more likely from HBP situations. It also creates higher exit velocity on well struck balls, meaning more full stretch plays in the infield and outfield, more guys crashing into fences like Eloy, hitters bashing foul balls hard off their kneecaps like Yelich and now Rendon, etc.

I don't see a solution other than front offices starting to realize that the velocity arms race comes with a ton of collateral damage and teaching young pitchers command and control instead of just how to throw gas.

I concur.  And young wanna be pitchers are trained to throw max velo from Little League up where they not only stress out young, growing parts of their body but also put way too much "hard" mileage of their arms from way back in their childhood.  But it is the only way a wanna be pitcher can get picked in the draft. 

Then these arms have to "grip and rip" with, as David Ross said recently, no idea where the ball is going to go so star hitters are dropping like flies too with fractured wrists, fingers, arms etc.  One of these days that batting helmet isn't going to do it's job right or a pitcher is gonna get hit too hard on a comebacker and someone is going to die because of all of this.  Then MLB will wring it's hands and say "oh we never saw this coming."

There were great pitchers in the past.  That softball post above is silly.  But those great pitchers didn't have to throw 100 because baseball hadn't become all jazzed up with computer stats and slo-mo video and sports "medicine" (cough) and gym rat mentality and max effort crap because just one mph could make the difference from a kid just playing a few years and having a nice, comfortable life style afterwards to becoming a mega-millionaire and having more money then they know what to do with.  Mega-money (owners and players both) and modern scientific advances and modern TV contracts and greed in general (for money and fame both) keep the injuries coming.

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Candidly, I really only see this as a pitching issue.  While this year may seem really bad on the hitter front, as well, I would wager that statistically position players aren't getting injured all that more often.

In regards to pitchers, I'm infinitely more concerned about the way youth and high school pitchers are handled than anything going on at the college/milb/major league level.  The number of breaking balls being thrown by folks whose bodies haven't matured into adulthood is out of control.  

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9 minutes ago, Overlord said:

Candidly, I really only see this as a pitching issue.  While this year may seem really bad on the hitter front, as well, I would wager that statistically position players aren't getting injured all that more often.

In regards to pitchers, I'm infinitely more concerned about the way youth and high school pitchers are handled than anything going on at the college/milb/major league level.  The number of breaking balls being thrown by folks whose bodies haven't matured into adulthood is out of control.  

But the pitching issue leads to hitter injuries. The main long term injuries hitters are getting these days are from out of control 100+ balls breaking their body parts.

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Just now, The Big Bat Theory said:

But the pitching issue leads to hitter injuries. The main long term injuries hitters are getting these days are from out of control 100+ balls breaking their body parts.

Might also have a lot to do with where players position themselves in the batters box.  There's a reason why Goldschmidt was hit twice in 2019 while Rizzo was hit 27 times that same year and it has nothing to do with 100+ out of control breaking balls, it has to do with the fact that Rizzo stands about a foot closer to the plate and looms directly over it.

While the angles aren't the best, just look at Rizzo vs. Mays and Aaron. 

rizzo-raw.png

Stances-togther.png

 

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Players pushing their bodies to the limit is what makes sports interesting. I hate injuries as much as the next guy (I own both Robert and May) but these guys get paid handsomely for the physical risks they take and a soft-tossing Dustin May might have floundered in AA or gotten hurt anyway.

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10 hours ago, dele said:

It's all about velocity. The emphasis on velocity means pitchers have to throw max effort all the time and you get the Dustin May situation regularly.

On the hitting side, velocity makes injuries more likely from HBP situations. It also creates higher exit velocity on well struck balls, meaning more full stretch plays in the infield and outfield, more guys crashing into fences like Eloy, hitters bashing foul balls hard off their kneecaps like Yelich and now Rendon, etc.

I don't see a solution other than front offices starting to realize that the velocity arms race comes with a ton of collateral damage and teaching young pitchers command and control instead of just how to throw gas.

Very true!  Everyone is throwing 95+ nowadays which just isn't good long term for your arm.  Factor in all the breaking balls which really put stress on the arm and it's no wonder these guys can't go more then 6 innings/100 pitches anymore.  20 years ago if someone was throwing 95 it was rare and while I cannot say for certain I would bet that injuries for pitchers were no where close to what they are now.  

As for hitters I think the focus on strength training has played a huge part in players getting hurt so much.  Sure they are bigger stronger and faster now but they also pull muscles that people didn't know existed 20+ years ago.  Not saying you don't have to be a great athlete to play baseball but just think of how much these guys stand or sit around inning after inning then 2 hours later they have to leg out a grounder and boom injury.  The way baseball is now with so many K's and homeruns doesn't really help this case because they are moving around even less.  

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Last night was I watching MLB Tonight with Amsinger, Lowell and Reynolds. They were doing a live look in at the CHC-LAD game and watching Treinen throw 95 mph cutters that had so much movement they looked like wiffle balls. They weren't shy about suggesting there was something different about the ball or potential foreign substances either. I thought it was pretty refreshing tbh.

I think it's far more likely that the surge in pitch velocity and movement has to do with the ball and/or substances than pitchers collectively getting this much better. I thought it was funny that they then flipped over to the SEA game and Kendall Graveman is throwing 98 mph sinkers. Sure, whatever.

 

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14 hours ago, sportsfreak2744 said:

Last night was I watching MLB Tonight with Amsinger, Lowell and Reynolds. They were doing a live look in at the CHC-LAD game and watching Treinen throw 95 mph cutters that had so much movement they looked like wiffle balls. They weren't shy about suggesting there was something different about the ball or potential foreign substances either. I thought it was pretty refreshing tbh.

I think it's far more likely that the surge in pitch velocity and movement has to do with the ball and/or substances than pitchers collectively getting this much better. I thought it was funny that they then flipped over to the SEA game and Kendall Graveman is throwing 98 mph sinkers. Sure, whatever.

 

Yes the arms are getting stronger so they can throw 100.  They are coached that way since if not Little League at least High School and Babe Ruth Leagues onward.

As for the wild movement this year more than ever.  They raised the laces on the baseball to give pitchers better grip and to "deaden" the ball some as in  laces will cause some friction moving through the air so the higher the laces the more friction.  Also the more movement on the ball with higher laces.  Coupled with the latest obsessive fad -- "spin rate" and the ball goes all over the place.  Like I said, David Ross said that the spin rate added to the max effort means the pitcher really doesn't know where the ball is going to end up.  It's called "grip and rip" and it is killing pitcher arms and breaking hitter arms ... and fingers and wrists etc etc.

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15 hours ago, MSkibisky said:

Bring back PED's. There, I said it.

You know I wanted to say the same last night but didn't want it to turn into a giant debate.  I think some people see PED's and automatically think STEROIDS but there are so many banned substances that these guys can't take that may help prevent and recover from injuries.  

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58 minutes ago, knifeparty said:

You know I wanted to say the same last night but didn't want it to turn into a giant debate.  I think some people see PED's and automatically think STEROIDS but there are so many banned substances that these guys can't take that may help prevent and recover from injuries.  

I'm talking big dirty, rusty, bent needles full of pure 700-foot-homerun-hitting testosterone being pumped into these fragile woosie's buttcheeks. Lets see a 75HR/60SB/.380 season out of Acuna.

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50 minutes ago, MSkibisky said:

I'm talking big dirty, rusty, bent needles full of pure 700-foot-homerun-hitting testosterone being pumped into these fragile woosie's buttcheeks. Lets see a 75HR/60SB/.380 season out of Acuna.

I view what Acuna is doing right now as far more entertaining & impressive than anything he could potentially do on PEDs.

For me, today's game has gotten boring because home runs and guys throwing 95+ are too common. It doesn't seem as special anymore. More is not always better. Today's game just feels like a home run derby but instead of throwing BP the pitchers are throwing wiffle balls.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well, now Trout is out 6-8 weeks. Feels like everyone is out or has been out, or is going out. 
Luckily I don’t have Trout anywhere but it’s still sad. I’ve noticed I don’t watch as many games recently. Not sure if it’s caused by massive amounts of injuries or not. 
Anyway, just an update and figured I’d check in to see if views have shifted on this. 

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